It is time to create a new page of “Interesting Wildlife News.” Please put your wildlife news in the comments below.
Beaver-felled willow trees. East Fork Mink Creek near Pocatello, ID. Copyright Ralph Maughan
Do not post copyrighted material, and here is the link to the “old” wildlife news of June 2, 2015.
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Dr. Ralph Maughan is professor emeritus of political science at Idaho State University. He was a Western Watersheds Project Board Member off and on for many years, and was also its President for several years. For a long time he produced Ralph Maughan’s Wolf Report. He was a founder of the Greater Yellowstone Coalition. He and Jackie Johnson Maughan wrote three editions of “Hiking Idaho.” He also wrote “Beyond the Tetons” and “Backpacking Wyoming’s Teton and Washakie Wilderness.” He created and is the administrator of The Wildlife News.
Comments
Ralph, another sub-adult grizzly was trapped by Pinedale and released in the, already to crowded, area 5 miles east of Yellowstone in the North Fork Shoshone drainage where grizzly 760 was released and promptly chased to Clark Wyoming by larger bears. Since this bear fed on some cows I think he was being set up for failure.
Daryl Hunter,
It seems likely to me that is the case. Thanks for the information.
I should add that the Western Watersheds Project is working to see that grizzlies are allowed to inhabit and prosper in the country just to the north of Pinedale in the upper Green River.
Nominee for the 2015 Darwin Awards:
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/man-killed-in-texas-alligator-attack/33992884
Sad.
Here’s another one. Sharks can be ‘very aggressive’. Who knew?
http://abcnews.go.com/US/watch-angry-shark-capsizes-mans-kayak/story?id=32186618
Please take pity on me. From now till the end of summer, I’m going to have to be tortured by forced listening to ‘shark attacks’ reported all around the coastline by the media. Make it stop!!!! 🙂
Happy 4th of July!
Ralph, what a great picture. I love seeing streams with the channels connected to the floodplain. From the picture it looks like this reach of the creek is healthy, at least from a morphological aspect. Great photo.
Wildlife related???
http://m.billingsgazette.com/news/state-and-regional/montana/montana-dogs-dead-after-being-poisoned-with-strychnine/article_4c0a8cd4-6c8e-5dc1-9f76-8a9d52973d54.html?mobile_touch=true
Saw this story Immer. A dated blast from the past re: Condon:
“This scene played out one winter night 18 years ago in Condon, and then again Tuesday afternoon at the Corvallis Grange as part of a new film project on a Hamilton couple and their wolf”
http://ravallirepublic.com/news/local/article_2fc71366-8a42-11df-8c92-001cc4c03286.html
Was the poison laced hamburger, addressing a perceived predator problem? And how does it differ much from baited, dangerous traps, set out along trails, public lands, used by folks, just out for a hike with their dogs?
And just a year ago, some thoughts on trapping, the comments are worth reading and some, indicative of the sorry mentality, still WAY too prevalent out here in the west:
http://mtcowgirl.com/2014/07/02/despicable/
Nancy,
Nancy,
I especially appreciate the clairvoyance in the 7/11/10 statement by “Rick” that within two years the hunting industry in MT would be shut down because of wolves. Guess his powers of prediction are somewhat in question.
Immer, I’d like to read in what context Rick made is prediction. Was it made in the context that if predation wasn’t addressed…… the Tester rider was April 2011. Do you have a link.
OFN,
It’s in the comment section of link provided by Nancy.
July 4, 2015 at 2:03 pm
Saw this story Immer. A dated blast from the past re: Condon:
“This scene played out one winter night 18 years ago in Condon, and then again Tuesday afternoon at the Corvallis Grange as part of a new film project on a Hamilton couple and their wolf”
http://ravallirepublic.com/news/local/article_2fc71366-8a42-11df-8c92-001cc4c03286.html
Was the poison…
Songbirds falling out of the sky in southeastern Idaho. Don’t miss the comments posted to the article.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2015/06/30/3875981_fish-and-game-investigating-reports.html?rh=1
Make that, southwestern ID. I’m directionally-challenged.
Interesting comments with the article.
The birds in the picture, however, do not look like songbirds but more like gulls in various stages of having encountered traffic.
http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/31640-world-s-forests-are-fragmenting-into-tiny-patches-risking-mass-extinctions
unfortunately brings to mind the last compromise bill by Congress that gave away 75,000 acres of the Tongass National Forest (home of the rare Alexander Archipelago wolf, think Romeo). Just when humans should be thinking about protecting every square foot of forestland, instead our representatives devise insidiously toxic opaque ways to maneuver more forests into the hands of developers.
Saskatchewan burns. Smoke blankets Midwest.
http://m.startribune.com/local/west/311636081.html
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/photos/saskatchewan-wildfires-threaten-homes-close-roads-1.3137252
Happy 5th of July everyone! Not exactly wildlife news but not hard to see the relationship of hatred:
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jul/03/south-flag-confederate-pride-hatred-racists?CMP=ema_565
Watching a handful of cow elk this morning over on the meadow. Pretty cool and then from another large section of willows following the creek, cow elk w/calves start streaming out.
Must of been at least 50 adults and a lot of calves. Bit of a traffic jam at the fence line but it looks like everyone made it over (or under) the fence. Would imagine they are heading for the timber and high meadows for the summer now that the calves are able to travel. Rained last night and the hills are covered in a dense fog. Beautiful!
Nancy,
Lucky you. The Olympic Peninsula is in a drought with higher temps, no rain and wilfires that are hard to put out in the old growth forests, especially in Olympic National Park. The consequences are showing. No mention in the article below about what this means to grasses in the high country where the elk likely already, but many of these meadows sub irrigate from snowpack melt. Well, no snowpack has been estimated at between 4-34% of normal. That means much of this grass will not grow. Berries in some areas are dried before maturing, so that means less for bears and other wildlife. And, in Seattle temps are hovering at about 90 degrees with no significant evening cooling. Not good for wildlife, especially fish as stream flows will be very low as the anadromous fish (salmon/steelhead) start their spawning runs from the sea. This time of year the Queets River in ONP is usually waist deep at the ford for the upper trail, and the article says it is just ankle deep. This is very, very bad.
http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/environment/burning-rain-forest-raises-concern-about-future/
Lucky me is right WM, but sadly, the next time I see those elk, will be when they are trying to migrate out of the area under a hail of gunfire, in the fall.
Sorry to see drought conditions are bad (and getting worse) in your neck of the woods (re: the article you posted) interesting the comments – all over the board on climate change.
Maybe Faison (and a few other wealthy Republicans) need to throw a few hundred more grand around, out here in the west?
“Jay Faison, an audio tech executive who this year set up Clearpath, a foundation dedicated to explaining to Republicans the science behind climate change and business opportunities to fight carbon emissions, said he had given $500,000 to Ayotte, who was elected to the Senate in 2010”
That should warm her cockles 🙂
http://newsdaily.com/2015/07/republican-climate-advocate-makes-big-2016-campaign-gift/
But, New Hampshire is looking almost tropical in the coming years:
“Annual average precipitation may increase 14 to 20 percent across the state. Precipitation events that drop more than four inches of precipitation in 48 hours are projected to increase two- to three-fold”
Read more: http://www.unh.edu/news/releases/2014/04/ds04climate.cfm#ixzz3f8pKMQ5d
IMHO – It should never have to come down to “lining political coffer$” when it comes to protecting the environment.
And that is where the idiotic resistance comes from Nancy. I wonder if in their private moments alone with their Grandchildren they ever pause maybe and offer them an apology for the future.
“The Federal Emergency Management Agency has authorized the use of federal funds to help with firefighting costs. Bonner County, Kootenai County and the Idaho Bureau of Homeland Security requested the assistance because the fire was moving rapidly and had the potential to destroy even more homes”
http://www.krem.com/story/news/local/wildfire/2015/07/05/evacuations-issued-for-cape-horn-area-in-bayview-id/29741159/
Yep, declare a disaster and toss available federal funds and resources at saving these poor folk’s homes:
http://www.century21.com/real-estate/bayview-id/LCIDBAYVIEW/#
Yep.
Thanks for posting that first article. I’m staying with family on their 10 acre slice of forest and farm east of Athol, practically in spitting distance of Bayview. It’s a small relief that federal funds are entering the fight. The winds are picking up right now.
http://www.ted.com/talks/hamish_jolly_a_shark_deterrent_wetsuit_and_it_s_not_what_you_think
This is very very cool
living in white shark waters with more than a few dedicated surfer friends, makes this as relevant as it is interesting
anybody know anything about the kill order by IDFG using wildlife services for two wolves that supposedly attacked a sheep?
I had a conversation today with a friend about some of my experiences commercial fishing and why I was influenced so strongly to stop fishing. I started thinking about a curious group of squid that followed me about and came to greet me daily when I did my daily snorkle at Bluebeard’s bay where I lived in St Thomas. In a protected marine reserve off Virgin Gorda, the fish would swim with you. I’ve seen enough fish underwater to know they are more than edible things.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/animal-emotions/201507/fish-smarts-why-fish-are-more-just-streams-protein
The weakness of the BLM has started a new trend in Nevada called “going Bundy”, ranchers openly and illegally grazing their land maggots.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/03/us/drought-forces-nevada-ranchers-to-take-on-washington.html?_r=0
RMEF providing $50,000.00 grant to IDFG to hire a wolf tracking expert to assist in locating non-documented wolf packs and to document mid-winter pack composition through aerial tracking and remote camera.
I’m not aware of any NGO organization that is solely involved in wolf conservation that is providing grants to the states of Montana, Wyoming or Idaho for wolf research. As the saying goes, you dance with the person who brings you to the party and that is why state agencies are prone to lean toward RMEFs mission. This is why I financially support organizations like Greater Yellowstone Coalition and The Vital Ground Foundation who invests their assets on the ground instead of lawsuits.
http://www.rmef.org/NewsandMedia/PressRoom/NewsReleases/RMEFGrantAssistsIdahoWolfManagement.aspx
“RMEF providing $50,000.00 grant to IDFG to hire a wolf tracking expert to assist in locating non-documented wolf packs and to document mid-winter pack composition through aerial tracking and remote camera”
Wow! $50 grand! Living pretty much in the middle of so called “reintroduced” wolf country for the past 20 years….. I’ve got to wonder why anyone is still throwing/wasting money on a predator that has had little, if any impact, on the livestock industry, let alone the hunting industry.
A sad but fine example, of the “chicken little” mentality so prevalent out here in the west.
And frankly, I’m much more concerned about the push to get everyone “on line” in my little community. They dug up (and trashed a lot of established water lines, septic and power lines in that rush) in a good part of the valley last year, laying fiber optics and, they are back this year, connecting everyone to the magical “grid” of technology.
“connecting everyone to the magical “grid” of technology.”
How else are they going to keep an eye on you? 😉
Perhaps the same thing going on in your neighborhood, Timz?
No, but I wouldn’t mind the fiber optic.
But I suppose that would depend on whether the fiber optics are worth more than the ability to keep in touch in case of an emergency, as we all are encouraged now (and given little choice?) to climb on board with rural telephone companies who don’t want any future competition?
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/2012/01/surprise-your-high-tech-home-phone-system-could-go-dead-in-an-emergency/index.htm
My rural telephone co. dug up copper wiring and laid new copper wiring just 7 years ago over a good part of this county and now its obsolete?
Hmmm. Could the results be trusted? I’m not casting doubt on IDFG, but the state government. I think they’d like to continue with their vague assertions that there are ‘more out there’. They might not want a real number or ‘less out there’ that doesn’t correspond with their propaganda and poor excuse for a management program?
Doesn’t IDFG have their own experienced trackers? Do they mean WS? The old wolfers I don’t think are very many now, are they? I’d trust Carter though.
Speaking of whom, Carter Niemeyer has a new book coming out in October entitled Wolfland with an introduction by Nicholas Evans of The Loop fame.
I haven’t read his first book (because I’m too afraid to!) but I should. I have two copies of The Loop, hardcover and paperback, but can’t seem to get past the part about Wolf Point, MT.
https://www.facebook.com/bottleflypress?fref=nf
JHC! Read Wolfer.
An update on the story I posted a short while back about the decision to allow a mining company to explore in the Frank Church. Several groups are trying to stop it in court.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2015/07/07/3885193_conservation-groups-sue-forest.html?rh=1
Good. It really does sound over the top anyway.
It’s revenge, they’re taking as many of us down with them as they can.
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/theres-a-disturbing-reason-for-the-recent-surge-in-shark-attacks/ar-AAcDiBq
https://www.facebook.com/oregonwildlifeviewing
video of Rogue river wolf pups
View the yearlings from the Rogue River Pack at play taken this spring. Also the site has kit foxes and other wildlife of interest. This years pups have not been seen but their scat has.
https://www.facebook.com/oregonwildlifeviewing
I thought I would pass this along (from the Wolf Patrol):
http://www.urbancoyoteproject.com/
The site heading illustration is wonderful.
Idaho: Wildlife Service kills 5 wolves
http://www.mtexpress.com/news/environment/wildlife-services-kills-wolves/article_2e2ac646-2507-11e5-b966-c32dd2a28611.html
Lynne Stone says: “These wolves were in a great place with lots of wild country,” she said. “Then in came the sheep and we lose the wolves.”
3 here, 5 there, and 19 in the Lolo zone? And this is in addition to an extremely unsparing hunting season. Was this information not released to the public until just now? This is what comes of letting a wolf-hostile state ‘manage’ it’s wildlife. I do sincerely hope that WS days are numbered.
I don’t see much going on for the sage grouse either; in fact just the opposite. No ESA listing, and no serious protection plans.
I spoke with a Forest Service employee yesterday about a different kill order for 2 wolves. I also had a very unproductive conversation with Mike Keckler (IDFG)but asked him to send me the reports on the sheep killed and the kill order.
What I found so far (from the US Forest Service)is that the permittee (sheep grazer) whose sheep was killed and dog attacked) tried non lethal several years ago. Defenders rode with the sheep, used fladry and other methods and prevented any attacks. Now the permittee does not want to try non lethal saying it cost too much time and resources.
So this year he brought his sheep through a passage area where there have been repeated prior incidents of wolf attacks on sheep. It seemed odd that the wolves attack in this area so frequently so I asked whether the wolves were protecting pups or whether this area was known rendezvous or rearing site. No one seemed to have the answer. M Keckler could not answer whether the two targeted wolves to be killed had pups.
The Forest Service rep was refreshingly candid and said she felt that killing the wolves was not an appropriate response on public lands. She asked me given the attacks, what I thought was the answer, I stated that given the the Forest Service are public lands, the managers might require the permitee to take others routes where moving sheep through will not result in wolf attacks and consequent wildlife deaths.
The USFS agent agreed to submit that comment. She also said she felt that there were higher ups concerned about the number of comments coming in against the wolf killings and that the IDFG aggressive policies against wolves was noted. Apparently the USFS has tried to work with IDFG to move from kill first ask later tactics with little result.
I thought about those calls for a long time, and did not come away with anything satisfying except to think that it does help to call. To sit by idly and bitch somehow equates to complicity in my mind. It might take a long time but voicing concerns is at this time is the one way to effect long term policy change.
I’m hoping for a change of guard before the wolves are reduced to Idaho’s target 150.
when and if I get the report from M Keckler I’ll share it. The USFS rep said she felt it would be helpful to contact the producer and put pressure on him and IDFG to move the sheep different;y and to insist on non lethal strategies as a first line of defense.
BC conservation officer suspended after failing to put down bear cubs
http://www.news1130.com/2015/07/08/bc-conservation-officer-suspended-for-refusing-to-destroy-bear-cubs/
Good for him! I hope he is reinstated immediately. Garbage bears, the arrogance.
Kudos to him, if only more conservation officers had the courage to stand up to bad wildlife policies
Today the House votes on the sage grouse and wolf riders attached to the appropriations bill. Inserting non-germane riders into appropriations bills, especially those that bypass court rulings, public opinion, and science really riles me. The non germane rider itself is a red flag that given the opportunity for airing the issue, the rider as a bill or a policy might not garner much public support. This kind of politicking on either side is bad policy.
In this instance, when the USFWS took public comments on grey wolf delisting, the service received more than 1,000,000 comments with the vast majority against delisting! This was the most comments ever received the Service on an issue.
As a citizen I don’t appreciate scapegoating wolves for livestock producer and trophy hunters and I don’t appreciate backdoor deals in the form of non germane riders attached to must pass bills.
Please make a call today to your representative before 1 PM before the house passes another sneaky delisting rider with a no judicial review provision.
Losing federal protections equates to radical people making radical policies that mean hunting wolves without regard to recent information that shows the stress that hunting causes to wolf populations, that hunted wolves are more likely to get into trouble, and that tolerance is not increased by public hunting.
Why do politicians insert these riders into must pass bills? 1) they are controversial and publicly unpopular and usually support a special interest, because in this instance scientists are arguing against a delisting, and because the state wolf management proponents lost in the courts.
Reposted from Howling for Wolves
Today:
Today there is a vote about wolves and endangered species on the US House floor. The wolf needs all of us to speak for her today. Call your congressmen and congresswomen before the vote session starts 1 pm EST.
Phone calls do make a difference.
Click this link to find your Representative and contact them: http://bit.ly/1M8UFwP
Tell them to: SUPPORT: Amendment from Rep. Niki Tsongas (D-MA) to strike all the anti-ESA riders from the bill (WY/Midwest wolves, northern long-eared bat, and sage grouse)
OPPOSE: Amendment from Rep. Dan Newhouse (R-WA), to block ESA protections for wolves in Oregon, Utah, and Washington. (Section 121 Amendment 19)
OPPOSE: H.R. 2910 (Mexican Wolf Transparency & Accountability Act). This bill terminates the Mexican Wolf Program and turns control of Mexican wolves back to the State. Stand with the wolf today. We must not fail them. Please make the call now. #LiveAndLetHowl
Done! 🙂
Delisting does not mean states must overhunt wolves, or even hunt them at all.
This rider is just WY+great lakes I believe, which is not the same thing as the “50 scientists” letter, which was about delisting the lower 48. Maybe you mean something else by that scientists claim.
Your “hunted wolves more likely to get into trouble assertion” is weak, very likely false.
Just trying to get the facts straightened out, which you too often stretch, if it seems in your interests.
Oh, and the question about trouble and tolerance should be whether we’d have more wolves in trouble (or less tolerance) with or without state management. I can say that right now there is no will in MI to strike down our laws that permitted wolf hunting, since relisting by the courts. I fear we will loose the momentum during this slumber (rider passage might change that).
what do you mean, MI voters voted down a hunt in the last election….
Rork, it doesn’t mean hunting should follow, but hunting does follow. MI has planned to hunt wolves, and so did WY, and WI. We don’t need a map to show us what will happen when wolves get delisted in these state. A judge stepped in to call a halt to overhunting.
I don’t think your summary of the verdict is adequate.
The judge said state “protections” were not adequate and called the USFWS rule arbitrary and capricious. amounts to the same thing essentially
in which state where wolves have been removed from federal protections have hunters and livestock producers not immediately pushed for wolf hunting?
I guess if you define relatively small populations of wolves in the NRM and the GL as “healthy” then random hunting of them using any method is probably ok too, and would not qualify as overhunting.
I don’t believe there is any good reason to recreationally hunt wolves and all the common management excuses are being dismantled with new studies, including the tolerance argument.
The riders in the appropriations bill relate to the Wyoming wolves and then there are two that relate to Mexican wolves and another to block esa protections for UTah and WA and Oregon wolves.
Those riders and bills popped up after the national delisting proposal, do you think the scientists that signed against a nationwide delisting might somehow conclude that the new riders seeking regional deli stings, especially in a state where no wolves exist, were suddenly a great idea?
as for the exaggerated claim about wolves getting into more trouble hunted than not
take that up with Rob Weilgus. I’m referencing a PLOS study that I can’t find just now but here is a link from Science and Nat Geographic and another study looking at cougars that illustrates a similar result.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/12/141203142542.htm
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/12/141203-wolves-hunting-livestock-ranchers-endangered-species-environment/
file:///Users/louisekane/Documents/Wolves%20&%20Wildlife/Impact%20of%20huntng%20on%20Wolves%20and%20predators/Effects%20of%20Remedial%20Sport%20Hunting%20on%20Cougar%20Complaints%20and%20Livestock%20Depredations.webarchive
The last post was to Rork
This post also is to Rork. Dated but interesting. The usual comments (back then and still) when folks wanted to believe in an unfounded threat.
20 years Rock and still waiting for “hordes” of wolves, decimating the livestock in my area.
At best, they’ve learned how to coexist with the small population of humans (who demand the most attention – ranchers) and also best, they haven’t decimated their natural prey base, so loved by, chased, killed, by humans (elk, deer etc.)
http://www.pbs.org/now/shows/609/http://www.pbs.org/now/shows/609/
That term, “decimating” addles me more than than the archaic “anyways”. Anyway suffices; decimate one in ten.
Like I said, Rep. Newhouse (R) from Eastern WA is a bit like Doc Hastings (light version for now). He’s earning his spurs right now, and in a couple years…..
http://www.yakimaherald.com/news/local/newhouse-takes-aim-at-epa-livestock-regulation/article_88043b62-2597-11e5-a7ed-a31bfb1daca1.html
I think this is tragic…
now its regular practice to bypass court decisions that protect citizens from harmful practices by inserting riders and or creating amendments geared to favor industries that pollute. What is really disturbing is that many of these congressmen and women don’t allow citizen’s from outside their state to comment on issues in a national or federal arena. I tried to speak to several members of the House Committee on Natural Resources and was denied the ability to speak to the policy aides who quoted that the representative’s office policy was only to speak to their constituents. I was told to take it up with my senator and I did. This is what I wrote today
Dear Senator Warren,
In recent times I have been consistently stymied in trying to reach state congressmen on issues that relate to natural resource management or federal public lands policy.
Today, I contacted the House Department of Natural Rescources to oppose several riders attached to the appropriations bill. I was then told to call the individual members of the committee to send a report I had composed. The call to the House Dept of Natural Resources and then to the Chair resulted in a circular and unproductive conversation that left me unable to leave a comment or send the document.
When I complained to the aide that I was disturbed by not being able to speak with a policy aide or other staff member because I was not a Utah resident, I was told to call your office as you were my senator. I did that and then I was referred to the scheduling department. Only the most determined person would find the time and patience to get through this maize of obstructions.
This is my complaint
All federal representatives, regardless of the state they represent, are paid with federal dollars,.
I believe it is wrong and perhaps illegal to ignore and deny comment about federal issues through representatives based on state citizenship. I have found this practice to be increasingly common, and problematic. Most websites stop you from commenting if your zip code does not match their territory.
I can understand a representative giving preference to its own constituents but once federal dollars are used to pay for salaries and office staff and the issues are federal I see a responsibility to hear and account for public input. This is especially true because most congressmen/women serve on one committee or more and these committees deal with federal issues.
In fact, as public policy I find it dangerous for committee members overseeing federal policies to ignore and deny other state constituents voices. The issues they are voting on are larger in scope than their own state concerns.
I find it very offensive that committee chairs and members only concern themselves with their state constituent’s concerns especially when they are overseeing matters related to federal public policy and concerning federal lands and wild and natural public trust resources. There is a very real danger that regional preferences will overtake national considerations in this kind of practice.
I would very much appreciate an appointment to discuss this and am asking for your assistance in determining what laws might exists related to this issue and if none do I am interested in seeing a congress citizens accountability act, if such an act does not already exist.
Best,
Louise Kane
Our congressmen don’t listen to we the people any more. I am very disturbed by this. Rep Newhouse is a criminal in my mind, he is not working for the people. He is working for polluters. on another about Newhouse, he is also responsible for the rider in the appropriations bill that would prevent federal protections for wolves in WA, OR and Utah (an irony in itself since no wolves exist in Utah). This just came out today, another poll showing support for wolves. Congress works for us and they are paid by us, at least they used to be.
FROM OREGON WILD
Majority of Oregonians Support Wolf Protections
PORTLAND, Ore – Today, Oregon Wild released polling data confirming that a majority of Oregonians, both in urban and rural communities, continue to support recovery for gray wolves. Support for continued protections for gray wolves was polled at 66% across the state, with 60% support in rural Oregon.
DOWNLOAD THE FULL POLLING RESULTS
“The return of wolves is clearly something that unites Oregonians who appreciate native wildlife and value the natural world” said Oregon Wild Northeast Oregon Field Coordinator Rob Klavins. “With the public’s support, Oregon has implemented the most successful wolf recovery plan in the nation – a plan that prioritizes preventing conflict and has allowed the wolf population to grow. But it’s too soon to declare ‘Mission Accomplished’. Wolves still need protection.”
Wolves are currently protected in Oregon by the state as an endangered species. While there are only 77 known adult gray wolves in Oregon, their population has reached a threshold where the Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife Commission will consider whether to maintain protections or delist them later this year.
“77 animals of any species across a landscape as vast as Oregon is not a recovered population,” said Oregon Wild Conservation Director Steve Pedery. “Fortunately, while a vocal minority attempts to undermine gray wolf recovery, Oregonians across the state recognize the importance of wolves returning home.”
This poll was conducted by Mason-Dixon Polling & Research, Inc. A total of 625 registered Oregon voters were interviewed statewide by telephone.
Another poll, conducted by Tulchin Research and released today, shows broad support for elected officials who vote to uphold species conservation and other environmental safeguards. Conducted in June for Defenders of Wildlife and Earthjustice, this poll shows that 90 percent of Americans support upholding the Endangered Species Act and are more likely to vote for elected officials who defend it and other key environmental laws. Read more about this poll here.
“I believe it is wrong and perhaps illegal to ignore and deny comment about federal issues through representatives based on state citizenship.
***I have found this practice to be increasingly common, and problematic. Most websites stop you from commenting if your zip code does not match their territory”
Been there Louise. And it does no good to contact your own rep, hoping they will contact that rep.
They are punching a clock just like the rest of us, only their paychecks, benefits, perks, etc. are a hell of a lot better than the rest of us.
Louise Kane,
I certainly agree with your anger.
Congress has rarely distinguished itself as democratic institution. How can it being elected on a parochial basis, but tasked with making or approving policy that affects all of us?
In the past, did some good work by having a strong system of standing committees. If a member wanted to write laws, he or she had to become knowledgeable about the committee’s subject matter. Now that has all been swept aside by political party and campaign donations.
It has become dysfunctional, a menace to our environment, our liberties and our economy. It fully deserves the 15% approval rating it gets.
I worry about it much more than any President. I think it is much more likely to destroy us.
if people don’t complain nothing will change
Its equally as frustrating that individuals do not take personal responsibility to challenge bad policies.
as a follow up had a short call with Senator Warren’s policy staffer this morning. I asked her to research policy and laws on congressmen and their duties to hear and receive public comment regardless of state citizenship. I also expressed a desire to see legislation introduced to protect the right to comment if no protective/legal means exists now. I’m deeply troubled that federal congressmen block and ignore national constituents on national policy and that local and regional constituents may be the only citizens to have these congress members ear.
The policy staffer said that many congressmen expect that by directing your comments to your own congressmen this suffices. I say BS, I know what happens in those offices. No one is taking the time to contact the other congress members about their constituent’s concerns.
sometimes its very effective to flood an office with calls to object to or support legislation and when an office is only receiving local calls than the congressman/woman is essentially basing national policy on regional preferences.
The committee chair on natural resources is Rob Bishop a conservative R who proposed the sage grouse amendment to the defense bill. I don’t at all feel comfortable in not being able to contact his office to object to the policies/laws he has proposed thus far and that are being voted on in other arenas.
http://www.concordmonitor.com/news/nation/world/17669336-95/loon-dies-after-ingesting-lead-fishing-tackle-ban-set-to-take-effect-in-2016
Jackson Hole: Hunters blame wolves for elk herd changes
They see no easy solution to the decline in the migratory portion.
http://www.jhnewsandguide.com/news/environmental/hunters-blame-wolves-for-elk-herd-changes/article_1ed82e45-b82f-5b79-9dbb-09d8eb3fb08a.html
“If a guy goes down to the grocery store and the first time he goes down there a thug beats the s— out of him, the next time he finds a better and safer place to buy his groceries,” Taylor said Tuesday. “It doesn’t take long. Those elk are smart when it comes to figuring out where there’s trouble.”
I think its a lot more complex than this simple minded analogy. Interesting how not much blame is being placed on over development in the Jackson Hole area, winter feeding grounds (the urban herd) and hunting pressure, which grew right along side the reintroduction of wolves 20 years ago.
“I’ll tell you one very simple thing, it’s called predation,”
When humans kill elk its called hunting, when wolves kill elk, its called predation. One kills for wall mounts, bragging rights, the other kills to survive.
Put an end to that massive winter feedlot in Jackson Hole and see what develops.
You know, these people have been given everything they want, every possible concession but wiping out the wolves completely. And it still isn’t enough.
What a terrible mistake allowing states to manage their wildlife, if you can call it that. It’s shocking that this kind of mentality still exists after all the misery they have caused. I’d love to know if the person who said that eventually these people would settle down after they got killing out of their system is now regretting those words.
I hope that if these riders make it to the President’s desk he will think of the disaster this kind of legislation by rider can do, and veto the entire bill this time.
15% approval rating? I don’t think it has ever been that low, and with good reason.
Modern people can’t seem to accept the natural predator prey behavior of elk and wolves, nor migration. Hunting has become an artificial activity in today’s world, and suburban encroachment too.
“Hunting has become an artificial activity in today’s world”.
I will argue that hunters in general have many (but obviously not all) of the same objectives as conservationists. They want wild areas where there are minimal roads and minimal rural development, protection from energy development and mineral extraction and strong opposition against state takeover of public lands. Hunting organizations like RMEF have restored and/or protected millions of acres; areas where their members can hunt and where the general public can recreate.
Hunting fees also provide funding for restoration of lands by state agencies, provides a way for more people to appreciate and learn about nature and a way for families and friends to bond.
I’m not a hunter and of course would rather see live animals than dead ones, but in general I consider them friends rather than foe regarding the protection of wildlands.
I guess I should have said a certain variety of hunter, who doesn’t appreciate the wild and who is just out there to kill something the laziest way possible, and/or to get a trophy.
I wish we’d come up with another word to describe those who like to be in the outdoors than ‘recreate’ – it’s a very detached, robotic, one-sided kind of word, implying changing the wilderness to suit human needs only.
Come and take a tour of the National Forest near my house after hunting season closes. Be sure to bring your rubber gloves and plenty of garbage bags as we will be cleaning up and hauling out pickup loads of trash.
and when you ask the BLM or Forest Service folks to go in and enforce a few rules you get laughed at.
The word ‘recreate’ does sound like just another bodily function, doesn’t it. Blech.
Thanks Gary. I’ll add that hunters can be used to reduce populations of some animals, and sometimes we want that, like with deer near me. I can’t say that for most animals though.
Ida: recreate part for me means doing something humans have done here for thousands of years. I feel some connection with them, and am experiencing that part of being human, hopefully with some benefit to the green world and people. I will spare everyone another blueberry picking analogy.
You might, but let’s not pretend slob hunters aren’t out there doing unnecessary damage, and who make all hunters look bad. I’m sure there are others like you.
I forgot to add MN to my list of wolf hunting states, not sure what WA or OR will do. CA I have faith in.
Montana: A New Breed of Ranchers Is Restoring the Landscape and Learning to Live With Predators
http://www.psmag.com/nature-and-technology/a-new-breed-of-ranchers-is-restoring-the-landscape-and-learning-to-live-with-predators
This Montana cattle ranch is trying to ensure its operations benefit wildlife—and yes, that means wolves, too.
This is about the same ranch that George Wuerthner wrote his scathing open letter about a couple days ago.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2015/06/150612-palau-burns-illegal-fishing-boats-pirate-poaching-marine-conservation/#.VZs6Ejw_ZCo.facebook
OT, but here’s some good news anyway. It’s about time, so that Native American schools can revitalize their cultures and languages with younger generations too:
http://www.sacbee.com/news/nation-world/national/article26850664.html
I taught in one of those schools back in the ’90s. Isolated, mismanaged, it was a disaster. Crappy old textbooks (the rejects from the Hopi rez!) and not nearly enough to go around, so we constantly had to make copies; then the copier broke down; then the teachers got blamed for excessive use of the copier! OMG, it was a nightmare teaching situation. In spite of that, it was one of the best experiences of my life–I loved my students and they reciprocated. I taught them everything from grammar to their own cultural history/stories to Hamlet. And they taught me more than I taught them. Like any kid anywhere in this country, they deserved a top-notch education. Like many poor kids in this country, they didn’t get it–despite the best efforts of some of their teachers. So I hope this new effort works…I hope a new generation of native teacher/reformers will step in.
For those who like environmental writer Tim Egan’s words, you might find this a good read – even a short indictment of OK Senator Inhofe who doesn’t believe in climate change.
http://www.seattletimes.com/opinion/seattle-weather-is-an-early-peek-at-the-future/
Also might note we had some injuries and a death earlier this week when a snow cave ceiling crashed in, dumping ice/snow on the hikers in the stream beneath. Happens once in awhile, but with this sustained hot weather it is making lots of stuff unstable. Can’t imagine what the Elwha snow finger is like this year for anyone with the cojones or absence of brains to try to hike it.
I heard about the ice cave collapse. It’s too bad those people were hurt; one killed. But aren’t there a lot of signs posted about not going in there?
Seattle’s normal climate is my favorite. Mild summers with cool nights; rain and misty grey days in the winter. I love misty rain and gray days. I find the Oklahoma climate especially intolerable in the summer. Too hot. Too sunny. I have an idiosyncratic seasonal affective disorder and become miserable in OK summers. I bitch all summer and people tell me to suck it up. However, this year it has rained all through May, which is usually hot, meaning we are well above 85 degrees; more like mid-90’s for a lot of May. We had a rainy and cool May. With July arrives hell season, but for the last 3 days it has rained with highs only in the mid-70’s. Unheard of here. People have been complaining. I tell them to suck it up. I’ve been unusually chipper this summer. Unfortunately, it is supposed to reach 98 or higher this weekend, and that with the saturated soil means it will be a steam bath. I suppose I’ll get back to my bitchy summer persona.
Enjoy your 85 degree ‘hot’ days, WM. And sorry to hear how bad the fires were in Wanatchee.
http://www.opb.org/news/article/new-year-brings-new-pups-to-or-7-wolf-pack/
In the 111-page ruling, Howell chided Fish and Wildlife for failing to explain why it ignored the potential for further recovery of wolves into areas of its historic range that remain viable habitat for the species. The court also noted that the USFWS has failed to explain how the “virtually unregulated” killing of wolves by states in the Great Lakes region does not constitute a continued threat to the species.
Call me crazy, but ‘virtually unregulated’ means overhunting to me.
http://www.wisconsingazette.com/wisconsin-gaze/us-judge-overturns-decision-removing-great-lakes-wolves-from-endangered-list.html
I see there’s a new report on Yellowstone wolves by Kathy Lynch, look forward to reading!
It looks like the EPA, wilderness and wildlife got a bit of a reprieve from the 107 riders attached to the DOI appropriations bill.
did you hear yet about the wolf riders, Yvette?
Wolf hunting quotas cut back near Yellowstone
http://www.bozemandailychronicle.com/news/environment/wolf-hunting-quotas-cut-back-near-yellowstone/article_f5c2838b-dc8a-56b8-870c-5ebeb1628252.html
“Wolf advocates got a small win Thursday, as wildlife officials decreased the limit on wolves taken in two Paradise Valley hunting zones.
Marc Cooke, of Wolves of the Rockies, was happy to see the commission take up the idea, saying it signaled that commissioners cared about people other than hunters and anglers.”
Hunter Who Killed Gray Wolf That Roamed From Yellowstone To Grand Canyon Won’t Be Charged
http://www.nationalparkstraveler.com/2015/07/hunter-who-killed-gray-wolf-roamed-yellowstone-grand-canyon-wont-be-charged
No surprise there unfortunately. We even had a hunter kill a cow moose and her baby and say he thought they were elk! Well, of course they are prey animals so that didn’t fly well. But these guys know they can use that excuse and get off.
this is real dangerous. Hunters have found a way to get away with killing a protected wolf. Claim he thought it was a coyote. This hunter should have been fined big time and jailed. He is a psychopath.
Article in two parts about the activities of the „Wolf Patrol“
Part I : http://greatlakesecho.org/2015/07/09/convicted-eco-terrorist-pursues-legal-protection-of-great-lakes-wolves/
Part II: http://greatlakesecho.org/2015/07/10/the-dawn-of-great-lakes-wolf-patrol/
Thanks for posting Peter, Coronado has a lot of courage and conviction. I know that will invoke the ire of some here but he paid for his crime and he is a much needed presence in an otherwise unmonitored arena.
Innocent Bear Killed Because Park Rangers Messed Up
Great Smoky Mountains National Park recently announced that officials had killed one innocent bear — and possibly two — in trying to capture the bear responsible for the attack.
https://www.thedodo.com/bear-attack-killed-smoky-mountains-1240692752.html
Hmm….
http://newsdaily.com/2015/07/u-s-wildlife-service-baffled-by-exodus-of-birds-from-florida-isle/
Tens of thousands of nesting birds vanished this spring from a Florida island refuge where they have come to breed for decades, leaving behind their unhatched eggs and mystifying wildlife officers trying to figure out why they disappeared.
That is eerie. One of the strongest evolutionary drives is to produce offspring, so for all the birds to leave and leave their eggs behind is strange behavior.
I wonder if the helicopter frightened them. It could look like a gigantic bird or a predator. I remember seeing formation flocks of Canada geese in the fall honking frantically, an alarm type call, when one was around, and turning off in another direction to get away from it. And the sound is hellacious.
Why can’t people find some less obtrusive way to get to the island? We have to make so much damned noise wherever we go.
I wonder if they could not find enough food
that Gulf coast is still seeing problems related to the deepwater horizon spill
http://bc.ctvnews.ca/conservation-officer-suspended-for-not-euthanizing-bear-cubs-1.2458792
http://www.spokesman.com/blogs/outdoors/2015/jul/10/wolves-kill-cattle-stevens-county-near-chewelah/
http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/2718783-155/bagley-cartoon-the-koch-brothers-utah
Luv it Jeff E. Bagley is always a breath of fresh air in this Republican jungle.
“Listen to the Pope: Don’t cause animals to suffer or die needlessly”
http://touch.latimes.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-83961226/
Excerpt: “As one might expect, I received plaudits from fellow Catholics for my anti-poverty and educational work but less support for my animal protection work. Most Catholics I’ve encountered seem to think of such do-gooding as fundamentally removed from religious imperatives.”
It’s ironic that compassion for others should be seen as “fundamentally removed from religious imperatives,” but this seems to be true for most mainstream organized religions. Speciesism is so pervasive…it’s the human condition that transcends all others. We can talk about love and compassion while sitting down to a meal derived from the suffering and death of others. For anyone interested, you’ll find a disorderly and incomplete list of animal rights-related faith resources here:
http://www.othernationsjustice.org/?page_id=3183
great post Kathleen
Thank you, Louise, and thank you for your relentless advocacy.
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/montana-wildlife-officials-cut-bobcat-quotas/34110938
http://host.madison.com/columnist/patricia-randolph-s-madravenspeak-are-humans-along-with-vanishing-top/article_c31dd2c3-e732-5831-938f-b77a0419be1a.html#ixzz3fdlTjzOq
I put together some information for those concerned with the House Appropriations Bill and the Newhouse rider as well as some actions you can take
The House Appropriations bill that was supposed to be voted on Friday contained an offensive rider designed to remove federal protections for wolves in Utah, Washington and Oregon.
Another rider was written to strip any “anti” wolf riders out of this or other bills. Rep Tongass D (MA) introduced it. It failed 186 – 243 but was supported by 9 Republicans and was, considering the House composition now, a promising vote.
The appropriations bill was supposed to be voted on last Friday but was not because house leaders pulled it after a dispute on an amendment from Rep Ken Calvert ® Calif that would limit or reverse 2 Confederate flag related amendments that the House adopted by voice vote last Wednesday.
It’s possible that more wolf-related amendments might surface when the House resumes consideration of the Interior/EPA appropriations bill. So it’s important to keep up calls and contact with Congress members.
These are some actions you might consider on Monday in case the bill comes up for a vote
• Thank the Republicans who supported the Tsongas amendment and ask them to continue to vote against the Newhouse amendment or any other rider that similarly targets wolves, when it resurfaces:
Republicans that supported Tongass amendment to strike anti wolf riders
Buchanan (FL)
Costello (PA)
Curbelo (FL)
Dold (IL)
Fitzpatrick (PA)
Hanna (NY)
Katko (NY)
Meehan (PA)
Ros Lehtinen (FL)
• Contact Democrats who opposed this amendment and ask them to consider a vote in support of the ESA and wolves
Ashford (NE)
Cuellar (TX)
Kind (WI)
Kirkpatrick (AZ)
Nolan (MN)
Peterson (MN)
Schrader (OR)
Walz (MN)
Welch (VT)
Contacts the House Committee on Natural Resources and urge them to vote against the Newhouse or other wolf delisting riders. The Committee members can be found here
http://naturalresources.house.gov/about/members.htm
Some talking points to oppose the Newhouse Rider or HR 843, HR 884, or any other legislation, such as HR 1985 or riders to the Appropriations bill, that would weaken the Endangered Species Act or delist wolves through congressional intervention.
• The proposed bills isolate and remove wolves from ESA protections arguing that wolves are recovered and states are better equipped to “manage” wolves. Yet, wolves are only considered to be recovered in less than 5% of their former ranges.
• In WA and OR, the removal of ESA protections applies to 12 wolves in Washington and another six or so in Oregon. In Utah not one wolf resides within state borders although suitable habitat exists to support wolves.
• Wolf populations may be relatively stable and perhaps even “viable” at some state levels, however, wolves are not recovered across a significant portion of their historic range, a requirement for delisting under the Endangered Species Act.
• These bills and riders ignore the voices of their own states’ voters, national constituents, recent and consistent court rulings and numerous nationally recognized scientists specializing in carnivore management and even former and current USFWS wolf recovery staff.
• In the United States when the USFWS service proposed a national delisting of wolves, an unprecedented number of comments (1.6) million voters responded.
• In Oregon, when reviewing a state management plan, over 90 percent of a staggering 20,000 public comments were in favor of stronger protections for Oregon’s endangered gray wolves.
• In Washington, 76% of residents favored strong wolf recovery and preferred non-lethal management.
• In MI, voters recently voted down (2014) public hunting of wolves by a strong majority.
• And MN and WI residents and conservationists are working hard to overturn overly aggressive state plans and to protect wolves from special interest agendas and a small but vocal minority.
• National public polls consistently support a strong ESA and wolf recovery.
• A new poll, conducted in June for Defenders of Wildlife and Earthjustice, shows that 90 percent of Americans support upholding the Endangered Species Act. Other poll results:
• Sixty-eight percent (68%) of registered voters are more likely to vote for a member of Congress who supports environmental safeguards like the Endangered Species Act, the Clean Air Act and the Clean Water Act.
• Nearly three-fourths (71%) of registered voters believe that decisions about which species should or should not be protected under the Endangered Species Act should be made by U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service biologists, not by members of Congress.
• Sixty-six percent (66%) of respondents reject the false choice between jobs or economy and protection of species and agree that the law is necessary to prevent species from going extinct. This plurality believes we can protect our natural heritage for future generations while growing our economy and creating jobs. Less than one-fourth (24%) agree with critics who contend that the law hurts our economy and destroys jobs. http://earthjustice.org/news/press/2015/new-national-poll-finds-90-percent-of-american-voters-support-the-endangered-species-act
• Wolves have faced historical persecution based on human and livestock conflicts but it is critical that livestock losses due to wolves and wolf populations be put in perspective. USDA reports respiratory, calving, digestive and other health related problems as the leading causes of livestock losses nationally.
• Livestock in the United States are counted in the tens if not hundreds of millions, wolf populations are less than an estimated 3000 to 5000 in the contiguous US, mostly on public lands, where hundreds of thousands once roamed.
The Endangered Species Coalition suggested the following actions designed to help wolves
• Do social media outreach asking people to take action by calling their House members.
• Earthjustice and Defenders of Wildlife just today released a new national ESA poll with fantastic results — 90% of voters support the ESA!
• The below sample tweets highlight this latest polling, and ask folks to reach out to their House members. #GreenUpCongress is the hashtag the broader conservation community is using for appropriations-related tweets.
• 9 in 10 Americans support the Endangered Species Act. So why are some in Congress trying to weaken it? #GreenUpCongress #standforwolves
• 90% of voters support the ESA, but some in Congress are still trying to pick it apart. Speak out! #standforwolves http://dfnd.us/1gbLe5J
• Poll shows voters want scientists, not politicians, to make ESA decisions. Hasn’t stopped Congress from trying. #standforwolves http://dfnd.us/1gbLe5J
• Voters know we don’t have to choose between jobs & #wildlife. Tell Congress to protect the ESA http://dfnd.us/1gbLe5J #GreenUpCongress #standforwolves
A note of concern, in making calls to Congressmen I have found increasing resistance by staffers to speak with out of state constituents. I believe these Congressmen have a duty to speak to and consider all constituents. They are paid with federal tax money, they are federal employees, and they are working on public policy issues that are national in scope. I have set up an appointment to speak with a staffer at Elizabeth Warren’s office on Tuesday to discuss.
Louise Kane,
Thank you for taking the time to give people this important information.
Thanks, Louise. Let us know about your meeting!
It’s the most bizarre thing, especially in the 21st century – why is so much time and energy (and taxpayer money!) spent on wolves and not on other matters? Strange. I’ve never seen so many riders concerned with one topic. States like UT and ID have special funds set aside for ‘managing’ wolves, but where does the money go? UT doesn’t even have wolves, and no accountability for how these funds are/were used, if I recall? I’m curious about Democratic senators who opposed the Tsongas amendment, esp. VT. Who’s got their ear? I find it terribly dismaying that Democrats are not supporting environmental issues.
http://www.timberwolfinformation.org/ut-anti-wolf-group-vague-on-how-it-spent-utah-taxpayers-money/
Can’t wait to see what they’ve got up their sleeves re the sage grouse.
This was an older article, but I remember we discussed it here. Here’s the original source:
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/55974984-78/wolf-forever-game-utah.html.csp
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/12/opinion/sunday/diversify-our-national-parks.html?comments&_r=0#permid=15461733
Why our parks are so white? I thought this article clearly stated a problem–a problem that does not bode well for the future of our public lands if minorities are not involved.
Read into the comments which are just as interesting. Does not seem that the general public understands the kernel of the problem.
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/bighorn-sheep-herd-in-montanas-tendoy-mountains-targeted/34110978
Let’s see if I understand this correctly – MFW&P is going to allow hunters to first kill the disease riddled Bighorn rams (no self respecting hunter is going to shoot and mount a ewe, not for $125-$750 bucks 🙂 Then the rest of the herd will be aerial gunned down (or by other means)
THEN, MFW&P is going to bring in a healthy herd of about 50 Bighorn sheep so they can become exposed (and infected) by the same domestic sheep, grazing the allotments in the Tendoys, that caused the removal of the first herd of Bighorn sheep. How much sense does this make???
Nancy,
Of course if “radical” groups like Western Watersheds have their way, the sheep will be gone from the bighorn range and silly, unpleasant things like this will not happen in the future.
🙂 🙂 🙂
http://www.westernwatersheds.org/
Well, at least the landscape can recover at some point. If it’s developed for homes or energy, it will never recover.
Plus wildlife is increasingly at risk for public safety the more land humans encroach into, like those poor little bears we’ve been reading about, and others.
An update Ralph –
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/Judge-says-he-won-t-stop-sheep-grazing-over-wildlife-worries/34133228
Not exactly wildlife news but it is, if anyone wants to wade thru the BS to the “finer” points of people opposed to Walker, now making HIS bid, among many, in the Republican party, as a potential, future president of this country:
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/politics/exclusive-walkers-sons-give-first-interview/34119876
Got to love it when the media hauls out the family members 🙂
The flip side of Scott Walker and his thoughts on wildlife:
http://wiwildlifeethic.org/tag/scott-walker/
I honestly do not know who is/has voted for this man and why he keeps turning up like a bad penny election after election.
How many times is this kind of updated footage of abuse (factory farming) going to make the rounds before humans start to wake up? The Food Inc. video covered it years ago.
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/money/tyson-investigating-claims-of-animal-abuse-at-chicken-farms/34124076
If our species continues to be blind to this kind of torture re: domestic animals raised for our consumption, I don’t see much hope when it comes to anyone caring much about wildlife and their rights as non human beings sharing this planet.
+1
I’m afraid it will get worse. I’m sure you already know but USDA is in agreement on the decision to ship chickens to China for processing and those chickens will be sent back to the U.S. for consumption. We won’t know which chickens have gone on the long round trip to China and back since the House voted to repeal the ‘country of origin labeling’ law.
It’s coming down to if you’re going to eat meat you need to either raise it yourself, hunt it, or buy from a local. As it stands now, I buy chicken thighs to boil and feed my cats to supplement their diet. I guess the Chinese chicken will suffice for my cats.
http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2015/06/house-votes-to-repeal-country-of-origin-labeling-for-meat/#.VaPWdPlVhBc
http://wivb.com/2014/11/05/opposition-brews-to-china-processing-us-chickens/
“It’s coming down to if you’re going to eat meat you need to either raise it yourself, hunt it, or buy from a local”
Agree, I’ve gone local for both my consumption and homemade dog food.
Is Nancy going to get and elk this fall?
Doubt it Elk. Although I have a friend who fills his elk tag each year just to donate the meat to elderly friends….I’m sadly approaching that category 🙂
Your thoughts on this:
“The goal is to reduce elk numbers in areas where herd populations are above the state’s objectives”
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/montana-wildlife-officials-seek-comments-on-elk-proposal/34120106
Would certainly fill a few food bank freezers around Montana, if “officials” got on board with it. But, I’m thinking it would be too much for wildlife officials to digest and then have to deal with.
Nancy, “The goal is to reduce elk numbers in areas where herd populations are above the state’s objectives” The majority of the places where elk are over their objective are places where ranchers are allowing more elk at the impairment of the cattle they run. From what I know these objectives are more geared to the social carrying capacity vs the biological carrying capacity. Why do we often call this “elk farming” when they are not above biological capacity? Isn’t the true elk farming in places where the animals are overprotected, like Yellowstone, Isle Royale or Rocky Mountain NP?
I find it entertaining to see the reaction of some on management of some animals above their social CC vs others above their social CC …..
Looking at it from my glasses, their is quite a difference if the animal is a predator or not.
There are no elk on Isle Royale. Elk/deer are managed for abundance by attempting to maintain ungulate populations in the “sweet spot” of sigmoid growth curves for a maximum sustained yield. In a nut shell, a cornerstone of wildlife management is to “smooth out” the peaks and valleys of population change, “primarily to maintain high, ongoing yields for hunters”
Therefore, it is artificially controlling the system for “yield”, or, farming.
🙂
Immer Knowing full well that predators like the wolf / grizzly bear will eventually need to be managed/”yield”, I take it that some here are in the business of farming predators then??
You knew that I was talking about the moose on IR, yet choose to patronize me. That’s not new for you is it? Are you the guy that told me I’m not “well read” and need to have things stapled to my ” fn forehead”?
Sustaining the population at population points that are eternally sustainable and ecologically balance sounds like a win for the local people and the nancy’s of this world that would like an elk in the freezer. Your lack of response to my carrying capacity double standard tell me things I don’t need to be “well read” to understand.
You knew that I was talking about the moose on IR, yet choose to patronize me. That’s not new for you is it? Are you the guy that told me I’m not “well read” and need to have things stapled to my ” fn forehead”?
If I made the comment that you’re not well read, and need to have things stapled to your forehead, then there is little reason I should believe I knew what you meant by elk on IR.
As far as social or biological carrying capacities go, state your point and support/defend it. Social carrying capacities of ungulate populations (for some at the extreme end of biological carrying capacities) are all well and good until unexpected winters or other abiotic conditions knock ungulate populations on their asses, which occur all too frequently. That’s what happens when you manage for highest possible yield. Then consumptive users moan about mismanagement.
What’s your point about predators? Other than the recent hiccup in regard to ESA listing, wolves have been trapped and hunted. Coyotes have been for lack of a better word, persecuted. The cats, mountain lions and bobcats are hunted and trapped, and the anthem rings for lynx trapping. Black bears are hunted, and the movement for grizzly bear ( a rare enough creature in the lower 48) hunting is building momentum.
If you’re concerned about biological carrying capacity there is an optimum number for predators and prey in regard to what is best for the ecological community of any given area, and it is the health of the community rather than merely the number of this species or that species with which we should be concerned.
Immer, please try to read this with your good eye….. “Isn’t the true elk farming in places where the animals are overprotected, like Yellowstone, Isle Royale or Rocky Mountain NP?” No matter how you want to read it, the statement does not say I said there are elk on IR!
I have no concerns, Immer, about biological carrying capacity, its nature for all animals to try to surpass it. All I’m doing is giving my observation that there is a different standard for different animals that reach the social carrying capacity. For one its called
elk farming (or should I say ungulate farming as to not confuse you) and a bad thing…. for other its a call to arms and write your congressman if we try to keep those animals at a reasonable SCC.
“All I’m doing is giving my observation that there is a different standard for different animals that reach the social carrying capacity”
Huh? In “Nancy’s world” (and I don’t recall wanting an elk in my freezer) Few see much evidence of predators/even wildlife because many are systematically trapped thru most months, moved around and shot at other months.
Its called “management” even here in what’s left of wilderness.
A good read ODFN – Black Hills/ Dan Simmons. Last couple of chapters – +!
Nancy, I believe I read Black Hills way back in 2010? Just for what it is worth ….villainizing white man does not change history. The biggest killer of Native Americans was NOT the white man, not even close. A case can be made that Native on Native atrocities is also on the list of villains behind disease. What I find interesting is todays villainzing of Christians that removed children from situations of high “native on native atrocities” ….. we no longer can discus how the different tribes fought worse than the Sunni and Shia Muslims or we are called racists. Trying to change history is pretty hard…..matter of fact… you can’t do it!
http://africageographic.com/blog/evidence-against-trophy-hunting-mounts/
http://m.reviewjournal.com/news/water-environment/military-takeover-nevada-wildlife-refuge-angers-conservationists
What I get is, the whole issue is about blocking access to one of the last remaining access points where one can have a view on Area 51.
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/hunting-ethics-campaign-started-in-montana/34120920
Apparently it’s more than just the oft-cited “few bad apples.”
A more detailed article:
http://missoulian.com/news/state-and-regional/montana/hunting-ethics-campaign-started-in-montana/article_0953860d-fffc-50be-aa13-16e1977ae013.html
Excerpt: “Come September or October, you’re going to see ‘Hunt Right’ everywhere.”
And an opinion piece:
http://helenair.com/news/opinion/an-ir-view-new-ethics-campaign-will-have-positive-influence/article_3c1daab4-21a5-5827-9f7e-a34eef6ac570.html
Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/HuntRightMT
Remember the story about the two mountain lion babies who were orphaned in a human-caused fire (shooting at exploding targets)? Taxpayers are on the hook for more than $94,000 in firefighting costs, two wild animals are condemned to meaningless existence in a zoo, and the perps are charged $9450 restitution and get felony charges dropped.
http://missoulian.com/news/local/will-pay-for-fire-near-stevensville-that-orphaned-mountain-lions/article_37d0cf52-7196-5608-a23b-434e7d1e86e0.html
It sure is a rigged system in favor of humans, that’s for sure. I remember that people tried to get the poor kittens brought to a sanctuary, or prepared for release in the wild, or even if their mother might have come back for them. The wording of the article was that their mother ‘abandoned’ them – not that there was a life-threatening fire caused by a couple of dunces that might have killed her. “Donating” sounds like first of all, something you own, and secondly like an inanimate object. Unfortunately handled all around, I think.
I thought that was a lovely post of yours btw, about the teaching you did.
This is where I have to part company with whoever it was who said human life is more important than animal life because humans have ‘hopes and dreams for the future’.
I don’t call going to the casino and planning the next drunken weekend bender hopes and dreams for the future! 🙁
I too was particularly rankled by the use of “donated.” But that’s how it is with FWP–animals are not sentient individuals but mere widgets to be “depopulated,” augmented, or moved here and there to meet “management” objectives for hunting. They’ve gone so far as to say that their management “provides” mountain lions for hunters to kill.
A friend’s husband who worked as a prison guard posted this comment this morning, “Justice depends on how much money you have. I’ve seen a guy get 75 years for stealing two pairs of Levi’s.”
My political science professor stated, “You will never see a rich man on death row.” For whatever reason, I’ve never forgotten that comment.
They must have had an excellent attorney, or maybe the judge doesn’t put much importance on wilderness.
They don’t sound like they are rich, or could afford an attorney. It’s probably that we as a society don’t put much importance on wilderness and wildlife generally, and this area doesn’t in particular, as we see over and over again. We put the importance on human life and human needs.
Making it a rich v. poor argument just sidetracks that.
I agree that rich vs. poor probably isn’t the case here–this looks like more of Montana’s usual wrist-slapping for such violations– but also agree with your poli sci prof. I heard Ted Kaczynski’s brother David speak at a MT Abolition Coalition program–he had teamed up with a Black man (Bill Babbit, whose brother was executed) who became his friend and they started speaking together around the country about access to justice by the rich and poor:
“He said the stories of Manny Babbit and Ted Kaczynski are similar in so many ways that the outcome should have been the same: They both were convicted murderers, they both suffered from paranoid schizophrenia, they both were tried in Sacramento and, coincidentally, they both were turned in by their brothers. (An elderly woman died of a heart attack after a break-in and beating by Babbit.)
The differences were, David Kaczynski said, while his brother is a white man with a doctorate in mathematics, an IQ of 165 and a Harvard diploma, Manny Babbit was a black man who had dropped out of school, received a Purple Heart for his service in Vietnam, suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder and could not afford good counsel.”
https://www.journeyofhope.org/on-tour/annual-journeys/2008-montana/10-10-daily-interlake/
http://ecowatch.com/2015/07/10/realities-of-warming-world/
Judge says he won’t stop sheep grazing over wildlife worries
More than 2,000 domestic sheep can continue to graze on U.S. Forest Service land in Montana’s Gravelly Mountains after a federal judge denied a request from wildlife advocates to halt the practice.
http://billingsgazette.com/news/state-and-regional/montana/judge-says-he-won-t-stop-sheep-grazing-over-wildlife/article_ca01ee4a-fe0f-5f99-8bd6-170e7bc525d4.html#ixzz3frvWTOjJ
I don’t care if sheep have been grazed 150 years on this allotment, this is a case of conflict between sheep (millions in the US) and grizzlies (~1,000 within GYE) and once again the Forest Service chooses livestock over a threatened species. It would be interesting to know just what actions by the sheep owners would need to occur before the Forest Service revoked their permit.
Time to send my monthly check to GYC for the purchase of bear proof food bins to prevent bears from getting into trouble. At least I know I’m making a difference with less bears being killed due to human conflicts.
Conservation Easement would be one way
This is a neat story of a black bear cub rescue in TN. The good news is the bear the Appalachian Bear Rehab Center believes this bear has a good chance to be released back to the wild.
Great work on the river rafter’s part.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/river-guide-carries-malnourished-bear-cub-to-safety_55a54ff0e4b0ecec71bd293a?
Isn’t she sweet. 🙂
http://upliftconnect.com/humans-arent-intelligent-creatures-planet/
Thanks Louise – fascinating article. We may simply be the most egotistical creatures, not the most intelligent.
Red wolf debacle shows USFWS missing spine:
http://www.newsobserver.com/opinion/op-ed/article26995669.html
http://newsdaily.com/2015/07/genetically-modified-diamondback-moth-offers-pest-control-hope/
So when the population “crashes” how will this effect other species that depend on this moth as a food source? Bats come to mind.
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2015/jul/16/sturgeon-die-off-in-columbia-spurs-catch-and/
Sturg are having some trouble, and the sockeye are stressed too. Sounds like it’s the important sturgeon too. (BTW: 5-footers are not “big” in my book. They don’t hit 100 lbs til about 6 foot. Also, we never fish them for fun. Feels wrong. Season’s been closed last few times I’ve been there, so we don’t target them.)
By closed I mean you aren’t allowed to kill them.
Australia Vows to target Feral Cat Populations.
Sorry if this has been posted.
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/16/australian-government-declares-war-on-feral-cats-in-bid-to-save-endangered-species
Some good comments below the article W. Hong.
Bobcat hunting law draws praise, scorn
http://myjournalcourier.com/news/83764/bobcat-hunting-law-draws-praise-scorn
A new law that allows the hunting of once-endangered bobcats in Illinois is pitting hunters against animal activists
I see some politicians saying they must be killed because of the danger they pose to humans (chicago tribune). One mentions 60 lb bobcats, 20% larger than the world record. When I meet bobcats I have never been frightened, only honored – I only get to see them for 5 seconds at best, except for once a decade when I see them first.
Can’t read the article you linked too – my google-foo is lacking today.
Nice post, rork. The following isn’t directed to you.
But bobcats harmful to humans? I would ask the governor, especially with yet another mass shooting, this time in Chattanooga, doesn’t he find humans are the most harmful other humans and what would he suggest to do about gun violence in his state?
http://heyjackass.com/
http://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/MIDNR/bulletins/10fd638
Michigan confirms chronic wasting disease in second free-ranging white-tailed deer. 304 deer killed and tested so far. New case was a 2 year old male less than a mile from the index case.
http://parkplanning.nps.gov/document.cfm?parkID=140&projectID=59316&documentID=66961
Isle Royale developing a moose-wolf-vegetation plan, and asking for comment. Options like augment wolves, kill moose, or do nothing. Killing moose in wilderness and recovering the meat sounds hard, unless you are right next to water and a boat. Maybe if hunter tried as part of a group it could work too (common in Ontario). Maybe the park people imagine killing some other way. I might like the moose gone, and transplant lynx+caribou.
Do caribou tolerate warmer summer temperatures than moose?
Black bear population is on the rise in Oklahoma. Last summer our tribal farmer told me that they had seen a bear the previous summer. He said the bear had gone down multiple rows of the watermelon field and split them open and ate them.
http://www.wildlifedepartment.com/media/bear.htm
http://www.ktul.com/story/29556693/oklahoma-wildlife-agency-says-black-bear-numbers-increasing
I’m kind of glad to hear this but am not sure it’s a good thing. Already someone commented about hoping they open a bear season. We already have a bear season; it’s an 18 day archery season.
Why is it always a bad thing Yvette…. to hunt or expand a hunt. I have yet to see hunted species in modern day wildlife management do badly….. Wisconsin has between 25000 and 35000 black bear, hunting keeps them semi-wild, provides a big economic resource to our community and keeps them out of our garbage cans.
http://www.wsaw.com/home/headlines/Black_Bears_Target_Bird_Feeders_Garbage_this_Spring_148004075.html
Most people in Oklahoma have never seen a black bear in this state. I’m not sure of the population, and likely, ODFWC doesn’t either.
“Why is it always a bad thing”…..
What is the point of killing another being simply for the point of killing it? What is the point of hunting bear? Or bobcat? Or Mountain Lion? Or any other species you aren’t likely to eat?
If you are at all interested in wildlife it is imperative (killing predators) to balance nature. Don’t you believe that Native Americans were killing predators in and around their settlements. I hate to bust your bubble but Yellowstone is not as good of example of what it was like 300 years ago. The places where MAN is part of the equation is a better example of how natives lived in years gone by. Some estimates are that between 100 and 50 million of them lived in North America before the settlers arrived. The fact is they did kill predators,,,, and overwhelming evidence says so. Killing things is a fact of life that can not be avoided.
OFN, don’t try to school me on ‘Native Americans’. There are 567 federally recognized tribes in America and that doesn’t count the ones without federal recognition. I wouldn’t venture to try and say what this tribe or that tribe does or does not do….currently, let alone 300 years ago. If I want to know something about a tribe I go straight to them and ask. They might share information and they might not. Some tribes I’m more familiar with than others, but to lumps all “Native Americans’ in one big pile shows how little you know about American Indians.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone post on here who said Indians never killed predators. At least, I’ve never seen it. I haven’t even tried to find supporting evidence, but I have my doubts that most of the Indigenous people on this continent killed for entertainment. My guess is that statement would hold for anyone with a subsistence life/culture, regardless of what continent they live on.
I first saw your post yesterday and decided to cool down a little before responding. Though German is the heritage I embraced as a child, I have others and my children even more that make my “schooling” of Native Americans quite unique. Nothing gets my goat more than the following…..
Tribal leaders using wildlife to support narratives and agendas that are easily discredited.
Those that try to rewrite history to villainies others and their decedents.
AND above all those that think their blood line gives them the right to try to “school” others …. IF you actually knew me you would know JUST HOW absurd your post above is.
Yvette,
That about clinches it. Outdoorfunnut, based upon his/her talking points, having perused some of archived discussions, is none other than Reality 22. Guess things are a bit slow. But that January post about MN wolf depredation removal/publication through this latest post. Bingo. The soulless empty bottle…
Nice call, Immer 🙂
This certainly explains your post over on the Climate change thread. Googling (Reality22 Native Americans) brings up lots of interesting stuff.
Immer, do you really think that this Reality22 and I are the only ones with an understanding that we are trying to create ecosystems that have nothing to do with years gone by? The NYtimes article posted in her/his Disqus history is interesting.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/10/opinion/is-the-wolf-a-real-american-hero.html?_r=1
Again, thanks clearing up your confusing post on the climate change thread…..and for helping me with my search for the truth.
Truth be Told, eh?
I don’t believe your emblem is a pic of you. My gut tells me you’re a she, live alone and made a living off the taxpayer.
The saying goes…… A SICK STAG lay down in a quiet corner of its pasture-ground. His companions came in great numbers to inquire after his health, and each one helped himself to a share of the food which had been placed for his use; so that he died, not from his sickness, but from the failure of the means of living.
*****
Your wildlife management ideals that believes in great numbers of predators are showing don’t try to cover them up with climate change.
So that’s what you bring to the table: a guess; a saying; and a fabrication.
I have nothing more to say.
Outdoor..nut,
Clue to Immer’s photo identity. Do a quick internet search with these terms “Kelly’s heros + oddball + photo”
And you might consider Immer has discriminating palate and a taste for “Bushmills.” While not always gender specific, straight whiskey drinkers have in my experience been mostly male. And, if memory serves correctly Immer is a well read and accomplished high school science teacher, who lives in wolf country in MN, and has for many years.
So, get off your high horse, and debate the facts and some of your goofy theories. You are obviously way off track with your baseless identity assertions.
Forgot to mention, Immer is multi-lingual and writes/reads German, and is a bit of a philosopher whose wisdom and insight is often needed/appreciated in some of the discussions on this forum.
WM,
Thank you for the kind words. In fairness though, I am hardly bilingual. If plopped down in the middle of Munich, I could get by, in particular with most German folks willingness to speak English. I confess that “longer” passages in the past were a result of English/German translator.
To my knowledge the folks at the Black Bear Blog are the ones to first imply that Immer was female. Perhaps that is where you got your “gut feeling”.
Barb,
That assertion always made me chuckle.
OFN
What’s your point. That article and Middleton’s formal study were discussed in detail on this blog.
It’s old news, and both works by Middleton were largely accepted on this blog.
Went to Reality’s disqus site. Almost 2300 comments. Perhaps I missed it, but in the Middleton article you sited above, I saw no comments by the aforementioned character.
“Wisconsin has between 25000 and 35000 black bear, hunting keeps them semi-wild, provides a big economic resource to our community and keeps them out of our garbage cans.”
Oh bullshit. How does baiting bear with cast-off human foodstuffs from April 15th through mid-October keep bears out of our garbage cans? The fact is we trap and relocate around 700 bears annually for nuisance behavior, mostly involving human food sources.
overheard while camping, “in a bears world, humans in sleeping bags are like soft shell tacos”
Reminds me of a Gary Larson cartoon:
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/149041068893525265/
Or the polar bear at the igloo “cold and crunchy on the outside with a warm soft center.”
“With less water and grass for his cows he will have to buy hay earlier this year”
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/Drought-assistance-program-for-ranchers-now-active/34226038
http://www.fsa.usda.gov/programs-and-services/disaster-assistance-program/index
Speaks legions about the marginal habitat for cattle grazing…
Also, can’t really make any conclusion per rancher political persuasions based upon article, however, the deep pockets of the Feds don’t look too very bad now, eh?
“To be eligible for disaster assistance programs under the 2014 Farm Bill, ***producers are no longer required to purchase crop insurance or NAP coverage, which was the risk management purchase mandate under the 2008 Farm Bill”
How convenient 🙂
Our fields are particularly lush this year, and nobody irrigates. Subsidizing others where this doesn’t obtain is bad for my local cow herders in MI and neighboring states.
Americans are Driving Wolves to Extinction – article from the Dodo
+1. Good article Ida and thank you for posting it.
Makes me ill (because of where I live – Montana) when I think about the hold the livestock industry has on too many government agencies/and local politicians, when it comes to “managing/controlling” what’s left of wildlife and wilderness areas.
Thanks Nancy – the Westernized industrial model is incompatible with nature and wildlife. It is sad that in 32 years, Japan’s wolves were wiped out, propaganda campaigns forced mind changes, and America helped them.
From the HCN:
300 million pounds of glyphosate are used in the U.S. each year, but its impacts are largely unknown.
EPA to Study Effects of Roundup on 1,500 Endangered Species
The DDT of the 21st century.
I like that they clearly stated the problem that banning glyphosate may just get you other pesticides that are worse, and it didn’t even go very deep into the alternatives, like Clearfield, which aren’t even GMO.
Two complaints. First, they discredited themselves immediately, making it sound like the milkweed depend on monarchs – I think several butterflies pollinate it. It’s the monarch larvae that need the milkweed. Second was that their photograph of a monarch on milkweed is not a milkweed. Reality check needed.
We’ve got two new invasive milkweeds called swallow-worts that are vines and attract milkweed-dependent butterflies to lay eggs, but whose foliage is toxic to the larva. Death traps.
glyphosate has a volume problem, says Brett Hartl, endangered species policy director for the Center for Biological Diversity. The sheer prevalence of Roundup makes its plant-killing effects felt on a massive scale.
This is the crux of it, I think. I don’t know of any pesticides/herbicides that are better or worse, they’re all designed to kill. But this stuff seems to be used by ton, with abandon. The scary part is the article said that no one really knows (or seems to care) what the effects in the environment are, only how it can help increase crop yields for humans. Since so much of our land is tied up in crops, and milkweed eradicated, it is still important to focus on glyphosphate.
The picture isn’t milkweed, but that is shouldn’t detract from the larger issue. I’m not sure what it is, boneset?
I haven’t seen Monarchs this year, maybe one, but other butterflies and beautiful moths seem to be around. I haven’t been to an Audubon field where there usually are many Monarchs.
Why can’t we find alternatives to killing? We’re always justifying our questionable courses of action instead of looking at alternatives. The American public is sick of it.
I’ve seen lots of milkweed coming back too, it’s really a pretty plant, and in the fall the pods are gorgeous.
The seeds lifting out of the pod are beautiful also.
For anyone that remembers me posting about the Oak Flats in AZ there is more news. The San Carlos Apache are fighting back. Good article on the ordeal. It’s not exactly wildlife news but is most definitely conservation on federal land news. I don’t know if you guys have watched the two videos about the Oak Flats but they show what a truly unique and special place it is. I think I posted links to them way back in December. If you want to see them I’ll repost.
This NYT article is a good one. http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/dotearth/2015/07/17/from-times-square-to-the-capitol-apache-protestors-fight-u-s-land-swap-with-mining-company/?smid=fb-share&_r=0&referrer
Propublica has been running a multi-part investigation on the significance of the Colorado River. This is excellent journalism. While not wildlife news, I recommend it as many of you live in the West and fully understand the significance of the Colorado R.
Great work here. https://www.propublica.org/series/killing-the-colorado
I thought I had a fairly decent idea of how abused and overstretched the Colorado R. but after reading this article I was shocked. Who the h*ll thought it was a good idea to grow a water rich crop like cotton in Arizona? There are no words, but there seems to be plenty of federal dollars to keep the farmers going. What a game.
This is one of the articles.
https://projects.propublica.org/killing-the-colorado/story/arizona-cotton-drought-crisis
+1 There are just some things that are not appropriate for the semi-arid zones. We need to change how we do things as our population continues to go out of control, and we require more water, more food, etc.
That article about the mining protest in NY was a good one too – how is mining for metals to continue our technology under the name of solar and wind and cell phones going to be any better for the environment at this rate? We’re really going to have to make changes to our lifestyles and make do with less, and live appropriately for the climate zone we are located. Wasting water for swimming pools, fountains, and green lawns is now a sacrilege.
We’ve had a flurry of news about the pulse of phosphorous sent to Lake Erie by abundant June rains. Here’s a short one:
http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2015/07/june_rainfall_discharging_near.html
NOAA predicts a near record bloom for later this year.
Agriculture in the Maumee watershed is the biggest culprit – there are studies of where it comes from. But I could use phosphorous on lawns being illegal in the entire great lakes watershed, better street sweeping, folks attending to their dog’s gut outputs, mandatory checks of septic systems, continued better sewage treatment, and better buffer strips and lots of other tricks farmers could do. I’d like methods of making phosphorous use expensive, to discourage it. Our “algae” blooms now are not the algae of the bad old days, it’s a cyanobacteria, microcystis. Bad for people, lake residents like fish, and tourism. All hands on deck please.
“Meyer is critical of state officials for seeking to cure the symptoms instead of the cause of the problems: phosphorus run-off from agricultural fields.”
That is an issue, but the manure is going to be produced regardless, so where is it supposed to go?
We’ve had a similar problem in OK and AR with the many chicken ‘farms’ operations. Phosphorus in the runoff from the chicken litter has had a serious negative impact on water quality in certain regions. About 10 years ago OK filed a lawsuit against Arkansas over the phosphorus load that enters the Illinois River on our side.
One of the solutions was to transport the chicken litter waste to other areas of the state where it was used as fertilizer. It sounds like Ohio is doing something similar by using cow manure as fertilizer.
Here is a presentation on a research project for using fly ash as a medium to absorb phosphorus in the Grand Lake Watershed. It sounds promising. The metal oxides in the fly ash react with phosphorus to form insoluble minerals. http://www.oclwa.org/pdf/2015Presentations/A4-Brown-bioretention%20cells.pdf
Looks like there is more interesting research from the Ohio State U. Water Resource Center. Page 4 of this newsletter informs of research where biochar is being used in vegetated roofs to improve the sorbtion of P.
http://wmao.org/wmao/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/Water-Table-Spring-2015-Issue.pdf
I don’t know if the climate has changed any in this area, but if the seasons extend or if there are more days of higher temps that is only going to contribute to the algae problem. Both cities/municipalities and farm/ranch operations are going to have to get onboard to reduce nutrients entering waterways and greater retention of what is produced.
“That is an issue, but the manure is going to be produced regardless, so where is it supposed to go”
Good question Yvette. An article worth reading on the subject BUT thinking its going to take much, MUCH “more than a village” to address it:
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2015/05/19/avian-flu-chicken-cafos.aspx
And, another good read:
http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/03/15/some-animals-are-more-equal-than-others/?_r=0
And all of these thoughts/opinions/comments? do boil down to how oblivious our species has become (being the dominate species on the planet now) when it comes to consuming other living, breathing beings with little, if any, thought/respect to the lives they gave.
http://www.tri-cityherald.com/2015/07/15/3653267_dozens-of-sturgeon-found-dead.html?rh=1
Sturgeon dying on the Columbia River.
warm water, low flows, low dissolved oxygen levels. female sturgeon not depositing eggs but reabsorbing them, stopping the circle of life…..and it is only mid-July. What will August bring if we don’t get some soaker rains?
And a little taste from our “neighbors”
The house passed the Resilient Federal Forests Act of 2015. Hopefully it will not be passed by the senate or if it does that President Obama will veto it.
http://www.fseee.org/index.php/ground-truth/sound-off/1004226
Some folks believed this sort of thing was inevitable with the shear volume of obstructionist law suits (many unsuccessful but resulting in long delays) used to slow or attempt to stop even valid projects. This same mentality is what is getting the ESA wrapped around the axle, and the outcome in this political climate is likely not going to be good for long-term conservation and environmental protection. Don’t expect an Obama veto if this unfortunate legislation makes it thru the Senate. It would be political suicide for the Administration and the D’s in the West.
Passing a law that requires a bond sounds like it may not be legal. Is it? I don’t really know. If this works then lawmakers have found an egregious and obstructive way to stop lawsuits meant to force them to protect our environment. If all a lawmaker has to do is pass a law requiring large bonds for any environmental/conservation lawsuits then we’re in deep trouble. If it works the politicians will use it for everything. There is not a group of people that I have less respect for than politicians. Most of them have the ethics and morals of Rock Snot.
If this passes it needs to be challenged in the courts.
In the 1970’s and 80’s environmental groups were instrumental in forcing the federal government to protect the natural environment, but IMO during the past 20 years they have filed lawsuits that are counter-productive in protecting forests in general.
Here in Oregon and Washington, even with a 80% drop in timber harvesting on federal forests during the past 20 years, groups continue to file lawsuits regarding issues such as harvesting methods, protection of streams, plants, wildlife, age of trees and road construction.
Federal timber sales are by far the “gold standard” when it comes to protecting the environment and I thought I had read where less than 10% of all federal timber sales nationwide are litigated but maybe WM knows this figure and he can chime in. Whatever the number it would be interesting how many lawsuits are successful.
NEPA provides for public input but apparently these lawmakers expect the public to pay for government costs if they don’t agree with the decision maker. Groups will certainly need to be careful with “frivolous” lawsuits.
I certainly don’t mind. Out nation values providing representation for those who can’t afford it, and give the protection from large entities who would steamroll over them. So a little lawsuit slows them down and is an inconvenience, and perhaps educates the public before it’s too late, boo-hoo.
But wait – so I guess this would apply to the Pacific Legal Foundation too!
Thanks for the input, Gary. I imagine there are some frivolous lawsuits, but I also believe they are the only option left at times. Maybe we need to improve our mitigation of disputes. This reminded me of something I read a while back that is timber related but a different topic.
It’s the timber harvests in the Southeastern U.S. that is related to Europe switching from coal fired power plants to ‘reusable energy’…..wood. It has stated a boom in the timber business as well as exporting wood pellets.
“White said that the surge in demand fueled by Europe has caused “the clearcutting of wetlands and bottomlands on a massive scale,” and that Georgia now finds itself in the crosshairs of the industry.”
I wonder if any of this is related to this bill. Additionally, who in the world would replace coal with wood to fire the power plants? Wood releases more carbon and is less energy efficient.
I believe to sue to stop a timber harvest on state lands in Idaho requires a bond.
WM you seem to generally categorize lawsuits that attempt to prevent agencies from running amok or that seek to protect vulnerable natural resources as obstructionist. Any lawsuit must have merit to proceed, legal intervention is often the only way to prevent abuse of discretion and or arbitrary and capricious agency actions. This is entirely separate from a disconnected political body hell bent on devastating some of the nation’s most comprehensive and valuable environmental laws without which US citizens would be living in even more dire circumstances and public trust resources would be squandered without any recourse. I see the politicians that ignore their constituents and our congress as a the problem, not the lawsuits.
++Any lawsuit must have merit to proceed.++
That statement is not always true, Louise. You know as well as I, or anyone else who has experience in environmental matters that the standard for “frivolous” lawsuit is very high. And, it is an obstacle that is frequently circumvented. Abuse of agency discretion is a question of fact that requires formal “discovery.” That comes later in the lawsuit after a fair amount of paperwork has been filed, costs incurred by the defendant (your tax dollars by the way), and time has passed. Environmental lawyers know this, and they are taught these tactics in school and in the NGO practices that all share information. So, let me just call “Bullshit!” on your statement.
And, if I recall correctly, a fairly high percentage of lawsuits filed (some successful, by the way) are based on alleged failures of agency processes, often NEPA, FLPMA based. The Congress passes some very wide ranging laws and then doesn’t properly fund the functions of the agencies to carry out the law. NGO plaintiffs and their creative lawyers exploit this gap, and maybe the should in some instances.
I would say Congress IS THE PROBLEM – sometimes they create stupid laws that won’t work on the ground and then in other instances fail to fund some of the ones that do. Of course, then, there are judges who are sometimes not as objective as we might hope to add their own spin to the issue, which then results in appeals and even more costs to figure out what the right answer is under the law,…. or even prevailing politics at the time. Can’t wait to see what the DC Circuit Court of Appeals does with the December wolf relisting decision by a judge who probably has never stepped off a paved surface in her life. Then, maybe it will be off to SCOTUS, or Congress could just nullify the whole thing with a rider.
I don’t remember as much as I should from law school but I do remember Rule 11 sanctions against frivolous lawsuits.
All lawsuits involve the use of tactics, evidence and strategy but that is not the same thing as frivolous or even obstructionist.
we seem to agree that Congress is a big problem, for various reasons
This trend to squelch all legal challenges is not democratic. This latest one is so outrageous as to be ridiculous. Wake up, people of America!
Top webcam ? (4:30)
http://rwis.mdt.mt.gov/scanweb/losttrail.shtml
Sorry, it refreshed.
Since I used the term ‘Rock Snot’ in my last post I decided to see if any new information was out there on Didymosphenia geninata, the diatom that has caused headaches in some good trout streams. I had been told it was an invasive species but, this link has new news on research. It’s good information for the anglers and those that work in surface water quality.
https://www.hcn.org/issues/47.5/the-case-of-the-snotty-streams
can someone suggest some documentary about deforestation / timber industry (tropics, boreal forests)?
This is making the rounds. Count how many times you can find ‘radical environmentalists’. Yet another bill with an extremely deceptive name. Next they’ll come up with the “Resilient Wilidlife Act”. What doesn’t kill them makes them stronger.
http://dailyjournalonline.com/democrat-news/news/opinion/columnists/legislative/resilient-federal-forests/article_f8ee70ec-5973-5c09-b741-20be5c321298.html
I wonder what George would have to say about “The Resilient Federal Forests Act”.
Just out from the USDA regarding sage grouse plans in Montana.
http://blogs.usda.gov/2015/07/20/new-report-highlights-sage-conservation-successes-stories/
A good source for information on west coast forests and fisheries issues.
http://coastrange.org/wordpress/
This thing sure moves at a snail’s pace, doesn’t it:
Disappearing Wolves, Flourishing Moose on Isle Royale Prompt Plan
http://africageographic.com/blog/leonardo-dicaprio-to-donate-15m-for-environmental-causes/
Very good speech by celebrity, wish more would become engaged
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/ct-rauner-bobcat-hunting-met-0715-20150714-story.html
Bobcat hunting passed in Illinois as governor signs bill that 75% of his constituents opposes. This is a troubling practice, politicians that ignore their constituents.
Louise, I am not surprised at such actions only appalled.
I figured it would pass, but I’m a pessimist by nature. So basically, they annihilated the bobcat population in the past, but it has rebounded so let’s kill them again. Essentially, many of us humans will hunt an animal to extinction or near extinction. If that species rebounds we don’t learn; the first thing we think about is how fun it will be to bait and kill them again. So frustrating.
The methods used to annihilate species like bobcat in the past – what’s that got to do with anything? You are talking like extirpation will be repeated, which is almost surely false. I guess you find it satisfying to note what “hunters” did 100 years ago but it’s not on point.
“Supporters of the bill argued that bobcats are now numerous, particularly downstate, and are a danger to people and pets.”
In all 24 years I spent living in Illinois, I’ve never heard a single story to corroborate this alleged danger from bobcats. If public safety is their concern, the wrong species has been targeted.
http://archive.ksdk.com/news/article/97452/0/Three-Injured-In-Deer-Attack-On-SIUs-Carbondale-Campus
My DNR published the much anticipated Deer Harvest Report (for MI) for last year on July 17, and did not even send out a press release, so there’s been almost no coverage. Hopefully no one will notice.
http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dnr/mi_deer_harvest_survey_2014_494338_7.pdf
49% of effort expended in the bow. 329,040 deer tagged, 15% down, no shock after bad winter and less doe tags (again). At the peak (when there were way too many) we were killing 500K. 41% of hunters tagged at least 1. Abut 175K cross-bow hunters, tagged about 60K deer. That’s about half the bow hunters. It’s a pretty new thing here.
It’s good to see those numbers come down. I recently had to drive through rural MI at night …there are still a lot of deer.
Press release came finally:
http://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/MIDNR/bulletins/10efbd1
The detroit papers are only running tiny AP news stories on it. We have no outdoors writers anymore, but we have scores of people covering meaningless team athletic sports.
You should become an outdoor writer! It’s good to have people who like to write about the outdoors.
I’m glad to see that wolves weren’t blamed for the decrease in deer harvest, but approx. 390,000 deer statewide is still a lot!
DNR won’t blame wolves much – they are scientists. The locals are a different story. But mostly they’ll say our DNR are fools, since they were trying to protect against an overpopulation by letting us shoot many female deer, when instead they should have foreseen that two horrible winters were coming, and reduced the doe tags. I typically point out that the results were identical in WI and MN, cause they had the same concerns and the same winters. So far I see no articles with tons of commenters, but we had many articles earlier in the year, since everyone knew the number of deer tagged would be lower.
MNDHA pushed MNDNR for increased deer numbers in NE MN. Just adds to the cycle for those periodic tandem severe Winters.
Ungulate managers have their hands full trying to maintain that “sweet spot” in sigmoid population growth curves to keep hunters happy. Winter severity can produce carnage in growth schedules.
Rork, Immer, I suspect you both might like this article:
http://www.calwater.ca.gov/Admin_Record/E-025180.pdf
JB,
Thanks, I just saw this.
the local wolves are off the hook.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/07/20/searches-reservoir-wolf-den-yield-no-clues-in-hunt-for-idaho-toddler/?intcmp=latestnews
I’ve been following this story Timz and something just doesn’t add up.
Fairly impressive that Washington state has 11 wolf conflict specialists and seems to be stressing non-lethal deterrents instead of other states who I will not mention.
http://wdfw.wa.gov/news/jul1015a/
Very cool and rare hawks. I see them once and a while whilst traversing the central valley. Sorry to read this:
http://www.kpax.com/story/29597627/baby-hawks-shot-and-killed-wildlife-officials-search-for-shooter
Jim Brandenburg “Nature 365”
Answering the Call
http://nature365.tv
Turn it up loud!
Nice 🙂 Thanks Immer!
What a sound! And to think we almost lost it for good. Never again!
Can you spot the snow leopard? Amazing photographs show the elusive predator stalking its prey in the Himalayas
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3169667/Can-spot-snow-leopard-Amazing-photographs-elusive-predator-stalking-prey-Himalayas.html#ixzz3gbCzNkGC
One of the most beautiful animals on the planet!
Summit near St. Louis to consider plight of endangered red wolf, as numbers halved in 5 years
http://www.startribune.com/summit-to-weigh-endangered-red-wolf-s-plight-as-numbers-drop/317867311/
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/Bison-injures-woman-posing-for-selfie-at-Yellowstone/34300336
“Stupid people are confident, while the intelligent are doubtful”
http://wildfiretoday.com/2010/05/12/stupid-people-are-confident-while-the-intelligent-are-doubtful/
Nancy,
Thanks – the Dunning-Kruger effect helps explain how we ended up fighting a foreign war in Iraq under the leadership of a confident “C” student. It didn’t quite work out to be a “cake-walk” and cost our nation dearly with the loss and injury of many young people and over $1T in treasure.
Another data point on wolf-cattle interaction in WA, and apparently involving a cooperating producer using non-lethal deterrents. In this case it is range riders (paid for by Conservation Northwest, a wolf advocacy group). If these wolves kill more livestock a permit to kill 2 wolves will be issued:
http://www.spokesman.com/blogs/outdoors/2015/jul/21/wolf-killed-cow-confirmed-near-cle-elum/
More detail on Conservation Northwest’s donor program to fund range riders:
++Between gas, supplies and pay for a skilled employee, a thorough range rider can cost ranchers as much as $20,000 per grazing season. But livestock producers who enter into our program can receive up to $9,000 in funding from Conservation Northwest and another $10,000 in matching grants from the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW), …++
Not cheap…but tolerable if someone else pays for it.
http://www.conservationnw.org/news/updates/range-riders-head-into-the-field
Dirty shirt pack blamed for the deaths of four cows earlier this month.
Two contracted range riders are also in the hills, and they and state staff are using spotlights, air horns and whistles, with back-up in the form of rubber buck shot, if wolves are in close range
https://www.facebook.com/WA.Wolves
I wonder how much all that effort costs CNW and the state?
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/07/22/travel/yellowstone-woman-bison-attack-selfie/
Stupid is as stupid does
“The family said they read the warnings in both the park literature and the signage, but saw other people close to the bison, so they thought it would be OK,”
Just following the herd, I guess. 🙁
You’d think that having read about other people getting to close and being hurt might have crossed their minds first? It just shows what a disconnect modern people have with nature, and generations of no restrictions on our behavior.
Bad manners and entitlement rule the day everywhere, and ruin the experience for others. I always go everywhere at off times and off season.
I’ll never forget the time I complained to park personnel about people getting too close to elk to photograph them. I was told ‘You’re not on your turf here’. I most certainly was if it is a National Park!
I had to chuckle at the comments:
Selfies Gone Wrong: Yellowstone’s 5th Bison “Attack” This Year
Maybe the bison thought she was going to attack them! Just imagine how we must appear to them, aggressively approaching with a device.
I wonder if these people are receiving citations?
No they are not according today’s local paper.
Lynx trapping regulations in Montana have been changed:
http://www.wildearthguardians.org/site/News2?page=NewsArticle&id=11689&news_iv_ctrl=1194#.VbFXhflVikp
“The use of fresh meat or feathers as bait is now prohibited in the lynx protection zone.
According to the best available science, these changes will significantly reduce or eliminate the risk of accidental lynx trapping and will decrease the likelihood of serious injury or death to the species if caught”
Feeling the “love” from this latest reg/ concern from MF&W about threatened wildlife Barb but worried that given the thousands and thousands of traps set to catch fur bearing wildlife (for profit) in this state alone, its just going to encourage an SSS situation.
The best answer to save this species in the long run? Put an end to trapping.
Many of our species today can’t imagine adorning our selves with their furs and I’m guessing they are getting tired of trying to keep up with our exploitation / interruption of their normal patterns of birth, life, death.
“his story matched the evidence found at the scene”
Kind of on the same level of stupidity as taking a “selfie” with a buffalo……
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/blm-idaho-cyclist-sparks-fire-by-burning-used-toilet-paper/34326204
Cool new cougar channel has just been launched by Panthera.
A clip from the email announcement with the link. This looks to be a neat channel for us cat lovers.
“Never-before seen footage of cougars (also known as pumas, mountain lions and even the “American Lion”) is just a click away at http://www.cougarchannel.org.
We’re excited to announce that Panthera is launching our very own Cougar Channel to showcase footage collected over 3 years from our Teton Cougar Project, one of the few long-term studies ever conducted of this poorly understood big cat. Finally, we can give these elusive creatures – often mischaracterized as solitary and vicious predators – the spotlight they deserve.”
A couple of news bites:
It was climate change that got the woolly mammoths.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/07/150723181113.htm#
And for the wolf lovers: A litter of wolves has been born in the UK, the first in 300 years. They are in a park, so not they aren’t entirely wild and free.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/litter-of-wolf-pups-first-of-its-kind-to-be-born-in-uk-10291802.html
This is a misleading headline. Britain is the birthplace of sensational journalism, among many things. 🙂
These wolves are not the native European wolves, but Canadian/Alaskan. They never were wild, the parents are from other zoo. No different than any other zoo animal giving birth.
I do not support taking animals from their natural, wild habitats and putting them into zoos and wildlife parks, no matter how it is dressed up to look good. It is unethical.
The 300 years thing I would think would or should apply to native European wolves born in the UK. So the headline should read ‘the first Canadian, Alaskan Hudson Bay (their kind) wolves born in captivity. There have been other wolves born in the UK under these conditions.
At any rate, when Alaska and Canada kill of theirs it’s good to know that there are a few left somewhere, albeit in less than ideal (habituated to humans and managed to an inch of their lives) conditions.
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-18714002
True true, Ida, and I almost didn’t post the link because of that, but chose to since this is only litter born in the UK in 300 years. They killed all wolves by 1500.
I’m sorry if that post earlier sounded a little too harsh. 🙂 But our attitudes are ridiculous about wildlife, I feel. Kill ’em off, bring ’em back. Rinse and repeat.
Not directed to you or your post. I always like to read yours and the links you post.
cougar? There was another sighting today……I believe a police officer confirmed it and said an adult cougar or young lion? They had the tranquilizers out and set up a perimeter….nothing. PER the Greenbay channel 11 station.
http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/police-lion-like-animal-sighting-confirm-on-north-side-b99544770z1-318552291.html
Salmon in big trouble on the Lower Columbia and the Olympic Peninsula due to warm water temperatures and low snowpack. Will sockeye make it to ID’s Redfish Lake this year?
This is very, very serious stuff for future salmonid runs.
http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/environment/snowpack-drought-has-salmon-dying-in-overheated-rivers/
WM,
I’ve read elsewhere, that at least per current conditions, that the only hope these salmon will have in the future is for the dams to disappear.
+1
It is to bad the lower Snake River dams ever appeared. If it were to be considered today they probably wouldn’t. Ditto for the Dworshak Dam on the North Fork of the Clearwater in Idaho which not only destroyed winter range for ungulates but stopped passage of steelhead and salmon.
“Idaho Fish and Game biologists said the unseasonably hot weather in the state in late June and early July had warmed and lowered the rivers weeks earlier than usual.
But, but, but**** they added this week that those conditions were not expected to continue to the point where trout, which are often caught and then released, would perish from the added stress of human handling”
So what about salmon?
http://newsdaily.com/2015/07/idaho-will-not-restrict-fishing-despite-regional-drought-linked-die-offs/
This Redfish lake, WM? (A live webcam I love to check in on most days 🙂
http://discoversawtooth.org/web-cam
There’s a trick where you “bottom draw” reservoirs, sending colder water from deep behind the dam over the dam. Big Horn river has it. Done properly it requires little or no power, but it does take some infrastructure.
I’m wondering about my chinook killing days this year near White Bluffs. And those sockeye were a real shame – I was hoping the huge run was going to better insure their future.
Most hydro dams draw from near the bottom anyway, where, coincidentally, the water is cooler. This water runs thru the penstocks to the generator turbines. The higher hydrostatic pressure from the deeper water with greater weight of water above exerts more force because of the effect of gravity, and spins the turbine blades with greater force.
The whole set of variables with impounding water, spilling water (some which is super-saturated with nitrogen that adversely affects fish)generating electricity and otherwise spilling water for flood control and navigation is complicated. And, one obvious consideration is that had the rivers been left free-flowing there wouldn’t be augmented water flow in the streams from the stored water in the reservoirs, and the streams would be dry, especially with the exercise of water rights for agricultural diversions. Nobody is going to let these rivers go back to their natural state, with the possible exception of some portion of the Snake.
Overall this stuff is complicated, has been studied to death and who really knows what the right answers are? Bonneville Power Administration, the Corps of Engineers, and Department of Interior – Bureau of Reclamation and others spend hundreds of millions of dollars every year trying to operate the river to account for all the stakeholders – much of it under the watchful eye of a federal judge and a Consent Decree in place for many years. Again, let me say, its complicated, and about to get moreso with changing weather patterns, maybe less snowpack and more erratic and ranging precipitation/temperature patterns. It may be just as probable to get heavy rains, or heavy snows followed by warm weather which increases flooding.
Waiting for the weather to change – how quaint, especially in our modern times. Wouldn’t it be better to take some actual steps such as voluntary reduction in our own needs, for the sake of another species other than our own? Or is the human juggernaut to out of control for that?
I was reading the other day that a hunting group is going to lobby to continue to hunt sage grouse even though their numbers are questionable. How can you have a conservation program when the ‘stakeholders’ won’t give up anything? When fish and birds are struggling to survive, hunting and recreation should be the first thing to go.
http://www.argusobserver.com/news/group-to-advocate-for-sage-grouse-hunting/article_492ccab2-3348-11e5-ba30-270340299b5d.html
Here is a new report from IDFG about the sockeye salmon working their way up the Columbia….. with a little help to spawn, and what it all means in rivers with increased temperatures.
http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/public/media/viewNewsRelease.cfm?newsID=7761
Would be interesting to know why all the trees lining the lake, opposite the fire, are dead. Anyone on this site, been in that area lately?
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/Fireline-explosives-to-be-used-on-Glacier-NP-fire/34364648
Might be a shot from the Reynolds creek fire area at SW tip of lake.
Some real time webcams around Glacier, none seem to be smoky except the nesting site:
http://www.nps.gov/glac/learn/photosmultimedia/webcams.htm
Rattle Rouser (i.e. Rome Wasn’t Built in A Day) Chief Conspiracy Theorist over at TR’s site has just called me an idiot. Whatever shall I do? *shrugs* talk about good for a laugh.
Well he got me kicked off the old BBB yesterday to win an argument there. I was kicked of TRs current site a couple of years ago. He has called me and others a lot worse than an idiot!
You can win arguments with them, they have a blind spot where wolves are concerned, why I don’t know. For awhile there they seemed to be decent and respectful, except for the wolf blind spot, but now the same old insults get thrown around – sexist, homophobic, racist, wolfist. I was curious to see what they were about, and I think I’ve seen enough. The Club of Rome stuff wears me out.
You can’t take your eyes of the posts, like a train wreck. One of them, Somsai, comments on every online wolf article ever posted, always with something negative to say.
Sorry, can’t win arguments with them.
A sampling of GF aka RR’s rhetoric to confuse the readers:
“Truth seeking intolerance on display by those throwing the conspiracy theory add hom bomb at those being critical of official claims.. Fact is there really is no conspiracy. What there is, is a lack of understanding of the language used by those with political rights by those with only civil rights granted them by those with political rights.. And when someone such as myself comes along and says they’re doing and saying the complete opposite of what those with only civil rights are comprehending is being said, they then show the true level of their ignorance by muttering something about conspiracy, big agenda, and paranoia.. When the fact is they’re provably illiterate, lazy, and paranoid themselves when their imagined political authority is threatened with the truth of their own ineptness in the use of the English language and legal terminologies..”
Dizzying….
I really hope this guy isn’t heading up any militia – his commander would have to slap him upside the head and say ‘Focus’!
I don’t know if either of you have read any of the research from the Cultural Cognition Project from Yale Law, but if not, here is the link. There are many papers you can read and the thesis is based on how individuals perceive risk and how that fits in to their core values and the groups with which they belong.
I like this paper to start with because it jumps right and explains the thesis.
http://www.culturalcognition.net/projects/second-national-risk-culture-study.html
Here is one on scientific consensus. http://www.culturalcognition.net/browse-papers/cultural-cognition-of-scientific-consensus.html
There are many other papers and there is no charge to download. There are a bunch I haven’t read.
If you’ve already read them and are familiar with the project just ignore my post. If not, it will help you understand why we do not make headway with the opposition no matter how many charts you show them, or how many published papers support your viewpoint. 1) we’re not in their social/cultural ‘group’, so we’re not to be trusted; 2) their perception is just different and I doubt that can be changed.
This research helped me understand why arguing over climate change is pointless. I see the wolf issue and other polarizing issues the same. Still, a lot of times people are just flat out wrong. And that is the way I perceive it, LOL.
Thanks, Yvette. I don’t argue climate change, but when people start talking 200 pound wolves, wolf lovers probably shot a particular grouse hunter, human foot prints are found in granite, and two ladies who died of exposure in the Craters of the Moon are said to have been killed by wolves I feel compelled to speak not to win an argument but to hopefully prevent a reader from accepting it as true.
Barb, I wanted to add that I heard my name being taken in vain over there, so I thought I would check them out, try to understand what those guys (and gal) are all about. They seemed to be fairly decent and respectful until one day low and behold, I started seeing things like ‘wolf and environmental prostitutes’, wolf ‘humpers’ and various rude and disrespectful comments. I have never insulted them, so I don’t appreciate their insults, especially since I don’t know any of them from Adam, and don’t want to.
What RR failed to grasp with his wolf numbers was that I was referring to the Alexander Archipelago wolves, where only approx. 60 are left, and yet that won’t put a damper on Alaska’s hunting season of them! When do we lay off?
RR fails to grasp many concepts.
Just read a little about the Alexander Archipelago wolves. The season starts in just a few days.
http://www.timberwolfinformation.org/ak-groups-petition-for-emergency-action-to-save-alaska-wolves/
Barb, does this look familiar?
“I have been extremely lenient and liberal in allowing certain conversations and attacks on people take place. This continuous barrage of personal attacks and the most crude and vial slander is not about free speech, no more than yelling fire in a movie theater. It’s childish and to be quite honest I am sick and tired of it.”
“It is protecting my property from something that no more resembles free speech and most resembles actions from a sanitarium for the mentally ill.”
“I will not tolerate personal attacks on anyone, any longer.”
Very familiar.
Barb, the irony of the outrage over Cecil (deserved) while Alaska, North Carolina and Arizona and New Mexico bully the USFWS and hunting of wolves that number less than 100 is unparalleled. The Red, Mexican and Alexander Archipelago wolf deserve better than the shoddy, shortsighted, deliberate mishandling by the state and federal agencies entrusted to their oversight. Some question here the value of a lawsuit, what else is left when hunting is allowed on a population of animals this small. Gross dereliction of duty is what I call it, criminal even.
“Fish and Game’s report estimated that the wolf population on and around Prince of Wales in fall 2014 was between 50 and 159, and most likely about 89 wolves, down from an estimated population of 250 to 350 in the mid-1990s. The report also stated that females have been reduced to only 25 percent of the dwindling population, posing a clear obstacle to the wolves’ ability to recover from their decline. The 2014 estimate does not account for the 29 wolves reported taken in the 2014/2015 winter trapping season, nor does it account for any illegal takes during that time or since, which studies indicate may be substantial.”
It is hard to believe the shortsightedness of the authorities in letting this hunt happen. There seems to be nothing an individual can do to deter such activities.
When I was in high school I was a pessimist but an optimistic one, perhaps man will use his brain to curb population growth and many related problems; the optimism has decreased through the years to just about zero.
From the scientific American: http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/extinction-countdown/alaska-archipelago-wolves/
Ida,
Ignore them.
Thanks Immer, I will.
Good news all, from the NYT:
After Killing of Cecil the Lion, Delta Joins Airline Ban on Game Trophies
Its announcement came as a group of airlines including Air France, KLM, Iberia, IAG Cargo, Singapore Airlines and Qantas signaled last week they would ban the transport of trophy-hunting kills, according to Paul Ferris, the campaign director at SumOfUs.org, a consumer-based petition agency in Brooklyn, which has pressed for changing cargo policies.
Such a ban was initiated by South African Airways in April, and Emirates, Lufthansa and British Airways later joined. These airlines pledged not to carry big game trophies, including elephants, rhinos, lions and tigers as cargo.
NC: Wild red wolf count falls as fewer parents making fewer pups
“Now the federal agency has drastically cut its population estimate to between 50 and 75 wild red wolves. While in the past wildlife officials have found 30 to 50 pups a year, last year 19 were found and this year only seven.”
http://www.wral.com/wild-red-wolf-count-falls-as-fewer-parents-making-fewer-pups/14794393/#b4SAxLYxFqx6BqJa.99
Only 100 Tigers Remain in Bangladesh’s Sundarban Forests, Survey Shows
http://time.com/3972820/bangladesh-tiger-100-sundarbans-survey/
Only some 100 tigers (not 440) currently roam the Sundarban forests of Bangladesh, a new survey has discovered, indicating far fewer big cats than previously thought in one of their largest global habitats.
Too funny WWP 🙂
http://jezebel.com/terry-gross-interviews-the-author-about-her-new-book-bi-1719997411
Every day the human race shows just how sick it is.
http://www.foxnews.com/science/2015/07/27/man-allegedly-paid-55k-to-skin-behead-famed-african-lion/?intcmp=hpbt3
as some would try and lead us to believe trophy hunting is conservation. pay a shit load of money to take your grossly selfish entitled self to kill endangered species or large majestic wildlife that are struggling and call it conservation. then get economic studies to show that the money is being diverted to conservation and justify a gross and immoral action
FYI http://wildlife.org/groundbreaking-wildlife-harvest-study-impending/
There is that nasty word, “harvest,” again, that some find so objectionable.
And, then it gets linked with a less objectionable term, “sustainable,” that is grounded utilitarian purpose – or being useful, beneficial or functional.
Can’t wait for the response from HSUS and like organizations.
So, is even the study of utilitarian conservation purpose immoral, Louise? Just asking.
“Already, partners such as the Dallas Safari Club, the Dallas Ecological Foundation, Quality Deer Management Association, Whitetails Unlimited, the U.S. Sportsmen’s Alliance, the Guide Outfitters Association of British Columbia, the Wild Sheep Foundation and the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission have committed to the project and active discussions are in progress with others.”
Not surprising to me to see these groups as supporting the project.
“Our best chance to conserve the natural world is to point out its value to people,” Mahoney said.
Perhaps that is true but I think we are on a slippery slope when we push the argument that wildlife and wilderness exist to create value for humans.
I know that the contingent valuation model has come under some criticism but there are numerous studies that illustrate some value wild places, clean water, clean air, wildlife and environmental amenities even when they may not directly benefit.
I think we need to be developing other models for conserving wildlife that don’t focus on their utility to humans. There are too damn many humans and that model, in my mind, leads to a slippery slope.
we protect those species that are perceived to be valuable and villanize those that are not. I see this model as dangerous because it ignores the whole idea of biodiversity, and I think its already being practiced and that is one of the reasons for predator persecution.
as for immoral…
I know you won’t agree but I feel that it is immoral to consider other lives as existing solely for my food.
I struggle with the whole food issue constantly, what is acceptable to eat, what does sustainable mean, how do my food desires impact other beings…
I know that I am seeing more evidence that other non human beings feel, perceive and experience stress, fear, pain, loyalty, and possess intelligence, empathy and grief.
To ignore that and not seek to change
Humans are approaching the 8 billion mark, Id like to see much more discussion on cutting down human populations and focusing less on maximizing utility of wildlife as food. That seems inapprorpiatly arrogant and ignorant somehow.
The author of this study clearly sees believes that the best way to get people to care about wildlife is to think of them as food.
this path feels like wildlife farming. That is how I think of current wildlife management anyhow.
It makes me feel awful
“we protect those species that are perceived to be valuable and villanize those that are not.”
Ba da bing. As the hunter’s say, “if it pays it stays”. So yes, we need to revise the paradigm, or it will be done for us and we might not like nature’s revision or methods.
Nutrition for the juggernaut – somehow, I don’t think there will be enough to go around, and it is not fair to think of everything as being useful to the dominant species. Other creatures have a right to exist independently of us. Offensive and unsustainable.
I hope the study is completed before all the salmon die off. I have yet to hear anyone speak of losing ‘livelihoods’ associated with salmon fisheries.
Ethics, of course, lies at the heart of this issue. If you believe that lions are entitled to be treatment that considers their own welfare, then the individuals behavior (killing the lion) is abhorrent, regardless of any positive outcome. If, however, you believe that lions are a resource for people use, then the ethical obligation is to other humans–thus sustainable ‘harvest’ becomes the focus. The fundamental question at work is “what entities deserve to be treated in a manner that considers their own welfare?” Some people would say all species, some would say ‘sentient’ animals, and others would say only people. For myself, I think the answer is, ‘it depends’.
Well one of the questions I always have with the ‘resource to use’ theory is what happens when the ‘resource’ runs out? We’ve seen it time and again throughout our history despite extremely large numbers of creatures (passenger pigeon) and the existence lions, elephants and rhinos are in grave danger presently.
Do humans have any obligation whatsoever to beings other than themselves, possibly cutting back a just teensy bit so that another creature may live?
The words and phrases we use don’t seem to imply any obligation to any creature other than ourselves, or any sense of importance to them. I think that there may be justifiable circumstances where killing is necessary, but a general entitlement based on might seems unethical to me.
Ida,
I generally agree with you. I think the problem with current management is (despite what advocates of the so-called “North American Model” say), the default position of wildlife management is, if someone wants to kill wildlife, then we’ll provide them the opportunity (assuming harvest doesn’t threaten the population). This has led to the situation where killing contest, dove shoots, and target practice of “varmints” are accepted out of hand. The simple solution would be to turn around the burden of proof; that is, to start with the rule that killing wild animals is unacceptable unless good reasons can be provided for doing so.
And here is where I suspect we’ll depart ways– I believe that the desire to harvest one’s own food is a very good reason to hunt/harvest/kill wildlife.
Maybe not – hunting for food or as a last resort for self-protection is the only reason I can accept. 🙂 But there are limits on it in modern times because we can’t possibly depend on it like we used to. Something needs to be done to protect our valuable salmon fisheries if we want that as a part of it.
I think these killing and bashing contests are just continuations from older days and do not apply to our modern era when animal populations are stressed. Somewhere along the way from DIY farmer ‘pest’ control it became enjoyable, even family, fun. A violent side of our natures that is undesirable and frightening.
Humans tend to be future oriented, but don’t want to give up old ways either. But something has to give – needless killing and unneeded water dams can go out the window now I think.
The desire to hunt harvest ones own food might have been more acceptable before there were 8 million of us and the unfortunate reality of that position is that it leads to hatred of other beings that compete for that food.
“The simple solution would be to turn around the burden of proof; that is, to start with the rule that killing wild animals is unacceptable unless good reasons can be provided for doing so.”
This is very nicely phrased JB. This is what I try to teach. Tough sledding some days.
It’s sounds like a a daunting task to collect and analyze all that data, and if he pulls it off it should provide decent information.
I liked that he qualified the word ‘harvest’ with recreational. I think he may be the first researcher to state it honestly.
Their study on the biomass of wild animal protein has nothing in common with what went down in Zimbabwe. Cecil was wild, but adapted to people. He was a park favorite. Tricked to lure him out of the park; shot with an arrow then wandered around wounded for 40 hours before they shot him with a rifle, skinned him, and beheaded him. He wasn’t food. Definitely not biomass. He was a prize and an easy target.
And now Zimbabwe will lose all the money he brought to the park. They need the that money. That is why they ripped 23 elephant calves from their mothers and aunts and sold them to China. Of all places, China. So how much in the red did this trophy hunt cost Zimbabwe? That’s not conservation by anyone’s standard.
timz and Louise, the hunter that illegally lured Cecil out of the park then shot him with a crossbow and let him wander for 40 hours before finally killing him, beheading him and then skinning him is an American dentist from MN. It had been erroneously reported that the man was from Spain.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3177303/PICTURED-American-dentist-passion-hunting-killed-Cecil-Lion-bow-arrow-Zimbabwe.html
Oh no. I knew it had that American stench to it. Luring the animal out of the park, then claiming it’s all legal we’ve heard that so many times before. That may work in this country – but other countries thankfully take a dimmer view. 🙁
I do hope that the trophy isn’t allowed into this country, especially since it was ill gotten with such terrible ethics. Didn’t the USF&W recently pass a law about lion trophies? Poor animal.
Officials state that Bronkhorst’s [hunting guide] son is wanted for questioning and that the lion trophy was confiscated, reports the Telegraph.
http://www.inquisitr.com/2289283/the-hunter-who-killed-cecil-the-lion-has-been-revealed-as-an-american-dentist/#J9JCSEfdtTVCUPmE.99
It says his ‘passion’ for hunting. More like a compulsion for killing. He’s been in trouble in the US for illegally hunting bears. I wonder how much poaching he is responsible for in this country? One thing you can always count on – their own ego and compulsion usually does these criminals in at some point. I think he should be investigated here too. This type of ‘entitlement’ can only be attributed to a select few.
The two hunters from Zimbabwe are being charged. It looks like quite a few laws were broken to kill Cecil.
1. Lured from the park with bait. That is illegal. The did it at night, which I read is also illegal.
“Now he is gone. According to information I have received, the carcass of a freshly killed animal – a ‘bait’ – was used to lure Cecil out of the protected area where he was shot with a bow and arrow.”
2. No legal permit. “Both the professional hunter and land owner had no permit or quota to justify the offtake of the lion and therefore are liable for the illegal hunt.”
3. Cecil was collared by Oxford researchers and the collar was removed. Illegal.
4. Walter J. Palmer, the dentist from MN has had previous legal problems over illegal kills before.
“The government proffered the following evidence at the plea hearing:
The hunting of black bears in the State of Wisconsin is regulated by state law and allowed only in specific geographical areas. When a licensed hunter kills a bear, Wisconsin law requires the hunter to immediately tag the bear and transport it to a registration station located within the zone or subzone in which the bear was killed.” http://www.weau.com/home/headlines/18015589.html
The Zimbabwe government has charged the landowner and the professional hunter. I wish or hope they also charge Walter Palmer and extradite him back to Zimbabwe.
They have claimed they didn’t know it was the famous lion. Liars. One could not mistake Cecil’s black mane. They knew.
Plus disposing of the collar. In the US they can just walk right in and drop the collar on someone’s desk. Apparently that isn’t the case in other countries.
In a way, it may now lead to better protections and banning of trophies. At least the EU is considering that. Imagining what must have gone on in these people’s minds before harming him is a place I am afraid to go.
timz and Louise, I’ve seen the stories on Cecil the lion on facebook but have avoided reading about him until now.
1. Cecil was radio collared for a study by Oxford researchers, and he was lured out of the park—probably baited as some articles have stated.
2. He was first shot with a cross bow but it didn’t kill him so the hunters tracked him for 40 hours before killing him and then beheading him and skinning him. Not only was his dignity in death stolen, but he suffered for 40 hours because of the “hunter”.
3. He was a park favorite. Cecil brought in a lot of tourist money. “Bryan Orford, a professional wildlife guide who has worked in Hwange and filmed Cecil many times, told National Geographic that the lion was the park’s “biggest tourist attraction”. Orford calculates that with tourists from just one nearby lodge collectively paying €8,000 per day, Zimbabwe would have brought in more in just five days by having Cecil’s photograph taken rather than being shot by someone paying a one-off fee of €50,000.”
Stupid. Just stupid.
4. Cecil’s 6 cubs now are as good as dead. With Cecil gone another male lion will fill his spot and kill his male cubs. Infuriating. And if one wanted to calculate the dollars lost due to the loss of those cubs you can figure in the tourist money spent and the ecological loss.
5. Zimbabwe is already on a hot seat because of the 23 elephants calves they sold to China. Now this horrific loss of Cecil who was a true money maker for the park and the country.
And the hunter? He’s probably back in Spain hiding like the coward he is.
this is why I’ve avoided reading the articles on Cecil.
Two people who associated the killer are being questioned, and is trying to stop the trophy’s importation into Spain. I hope bribery can work both ways:
http://www.inquisitr.com/2287061/cecil-the-lion-killed-in-zimbabwe-safari-tourist-is-the-suspected-killer/
I hope they track that Spaniard. Even Spain is pissed.
Yes. There was something especially cruel about this, a lot like the Alaskan wolf Romeo. Destroying something because it represented something good and that people loved.
+1 yes like Romeo indeed, twisted
Whenever I see a wild animal I hope they take care not to be seen the next time because humans are not to be trusted.
You know Yvette, I’ve needed a break. The sickening endless stream of death of wildlife by hunters, poachers and the lack of enforcement and resistance to institutionally biased toward killing and lethal control literally makes me sick. This is just one more story. No being should ever be shot with a bow and arrow, what a horrible way to die and if you look at the sites you’ll find that most animals are not dispatched immediately, they suffer. The bow and arrow hunters talk about the skill it takes, what about the pain it inflicts?
do animals exist only to perfect target practice skills?
A skilled shot with a rifle can kill an animal 400 yards away. It’s almost not fair. Most bowhunters I know do not even consider taking shot from further than 40-45 yards. I’ve switched to using a compound bow from a firearm, because I know that if I do fill my tag, I’ll personally feel like I have earned it and the meals that would follow suit.
“do animals exist only to perfect target practice skills?”
I practice using targets, not living animals. If I’m out of practice and can’t keep a grouping inside the diameter of a business card, then the bow is replaced by a camera on my excursions until my groupings are tight again.
Also worth noting: the broadheads for arrows sold these days are so razor-sharp that many times an animal won’t even know it has been hit when a shot is well-placed.
I’m not here to defend that deranged dentist. I see no glory in killing in any animal and especially such a magnificent creature as Cecil. I’m saying that many of us bowhunters who eat what we kill prefer to do so ethically. I have a feeling that someone willing to kill a lion for the rush and the trophy wouldn’t be hindered with such moral obligations.
let me ask you a question
if you had to make a choice
you were going to die one way or another
and the choice was by bow and arrow or rifle shot
what would you choose and would it make one bit of difference if the shooter said that he felt he earned his kill using the bow and arrow. If the board heads are so effective then what is the difference between using a rifle and a cross bow?
it matters not to me that it makes the bow hunter feel more accomplished I’ve seen enough postings about animals taking days to die with arrows in them and seen images of deer with arrows trying to eat and I’ve to see the damage that arrows do.
Hunters claim its all about taking the right shot, how many william tells are out there
+ 1 Louise.
I was just trying to wrap my mind around this comment by PS:
“because I know that if I do fill my tag, I’ll personally feel like I have earned it and the meals that would follow suit”
Not a mention of how grateful he(or other hunters) ought to feel about the taking of that life.
SB (do miss his comments here) a bow hunter, at least had the decency to take the time to thank/appreciate that life, for the meals it provided.
Nancy I agree to a certain extent but being grateful also does not reduce suffering, I’m betting that it does take more skill to bow and arrow hunt so that the good hunters are maybe great shots but what about the bad shots and either way the animal is hit by an arrow! I can only imagine how horrible that would be and I’m betting the animal that is being shot at would much prefer a bullet.
bow and arrow hunting seems all about the prowess of the hunter and the elation they get in the skill, its not about a quick and painless death. I’ll try and find one of the videos I saw of a man teaching his son to hunt and the deer that was shot three times with an arrow before it died while the son was learning…..
made me very very sad that torturous ways to kill animals are not outlawed like trapping, snaring and arrows. Animals have no rights to be free from human induced suffering that exists only because it heightens a sense of ability/accomplishment.
Nancy,
Being thankful to the creature that had given its life to sustain mine is always at the forefront of my mind in that situation. It doesn’t matter if it’s a fish, a goose, or a deer. I don’t take killing lightly. I’ve been around and hunted with guns almost my whole life. I’ve seen groups of beer-swilling lawyers and bankers lay waste to dozens of geese at a time from a single position or plugging whitetailed deer from their back porch. Weekend warriors killing wildlife because it’s fun, tasty, and easy.
To me hunting is very different experience. It’s about being in nature as a participant and seeing real life unfolding around me. It’s about reading signs in the brush and keeping ones senses attuned. It’s about getting up when it’s still dark outside to hoof it through the backcountry without getting lost. It’s about working hard to actively harvest my own food. The compound bow is a tool to do this and I work very hard to ensure that I am able to use it effectively. I do not mind if another hunter wishes to use a rifle or shotgun, but they’re not for me anymore.
you did not answer the question, death by arrow or bullet?
Put me in a firing line, bullet. Put me in the woods against a hunter, I’d hope he was carrying s bow. Improved survival chances.
A broad head arrow will cut and slice, but a bullet has shock value. Hit a deer in the shoulder with a bullet and the meat is jellied.
PS maybe improved for humans that can get medical attention not for wildlife, just increased suffering
Louise,
The range of a bow is drastically reduced compared to the range of a scoped rifle. Wildlife are more likely to detect the archer and flee before the hunter is even in range, or remain beyond the range of the archer if they’re hunkered down in a blind. Rifles greatly extend this range and make it easier to kill without detection. You also assume that everyone with a rifle is skilled enough to kill with a single round.
“Being thankful to the creature that had given its life to sustain mine is always at the forefront of my mind in that situation.”
Animals don’t “give” their lives or make a “sacrifice”–their lives are violently taken from them for sport, for trophies, for food. Dishonest language serves to perpetuate the oppressions that serve the status quo, and language like this (animals ‘giving’ their lives) perpetuates speciesism. And giving thanks to the sentient being who wanted to live but was robbed of his/her life for *whatever* reason might make the killer feel better, but means nothing to the dead animal.
A great many meme-type items are making the rounds now on animal rights social media (here’s one
https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=880603802016698&id=129598773783875 ) and the gist is that if you’re outraged over Cecil’s death, you should be outraged over all the nameless factory farmed animals who also valued their lives and wanted to live. It’s not about the lion’s value to the national park, to tourism, or even the value of his genes to his species–it’s about the value of animals’ lives to animals themselves.
Kathleen,
The reason I hunt is because I oppose the treatment of factory-farmed animals and it is extremely difficult for me to afford responsibly-sourced meat. I live in a studio apartment in downtown LA with my girlfriend and two cats. Before that I lived in the west side of Chicago. I have no land with which to plant a garden and organic produce is cost-prohibitive.
When it comes to healthy food options, most weeks out of the year my options are limited. Fishing and hunting are both activities that I enjoy and get me out of the claustrophobia of the city. If the end result is me violently taking the life of a free-ranging animal so that my girlfriend and I can eat some healthier food instead of processed 99 cent store bullsh*t for a few weeks or months, then call me a speciesist, or say I’m perpetuating speciesism if you want. It’s not my problem.
“The range of a bow is drastically reduced compared to the range of a scoped rifle”
Seems there’s been some improvement in that area over the years PS. I think Jimmy Kimmel nailed it with his suggestion about that little pill being a better alternative 🙂
http://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/hunting/2009/03/discussion-topic-putting-scopes-bows
“I have no land with which to plant a garden and organic produce is cost-prohibitive”
Got to stop whining PS if you actually care. Supporting locally, organically grown produce, your support will eventually bring the price down:
http://www.localharvest.org/south-central-farmers-cooperative-M23484
“I think Jimmy Kimmel nailed it with his suggestion about that little pill being a better alternative :)”
What makes me feel good is getting outside, hiking, fishing, hunting (for food, not trophies), mountain biking, wildlife and scenery photography, volunteering at my local German shepherd shelter and with Audubon Society, library visits, and a good IPA. Who needs a pill? 😀
That co-op looks like a bargain to join. Thank you for the information.
I too miss SB’s commentary.
Louise,
Don’t you suppose there are also other ways to die in nature? Don’t set up some false dichotomy as between only two ways for an animal to die, with the one being more agonizing. A critic just might throw in death by starvation, or the animal having its guts torn out by a pack of predators while it is still alive – I won’t mention the species, but I think you get the picture. And, of course, predators don’t always immediately get their prey either; starvation, of course, can take weeks, in deep snow.
WM humans are able to minimize suffering when they kill for food wild animals must use the only tools they have
From Johnny Rodrigues, the chairman for Zimbabwe Conservation Task Force.
He told Mashable on Monday that “the loss of Cecil is a “total tragedy,” and that the hunt was “absolutely illegal.”
“It’s a tragedy that we are taking something that belongs to future generations and shooting these animals just because somebody is on an ego trip and they can afford it,” Rodrigues said. “How do you bait an animal out of its habitat to kill it and consider it legal?”
This is trophy hunting… taking wild animals from the gene pool, taking the largest, strongest and most beautiful and stealing them from everyone for the joy of killing. and ending lives for sport, not acceptable.
No matter how you look at it, the myth about trophy hunting benefiting conservation just isn’t true. As Yvette said, these killings not only do not help conservation at all but actually has take away money for those who depend on tourist income at the park. Cecil would have brought many more visitors and much joy and awe, but now with one hunting trip he has been destroyed to satisfy some guy’s monstrous ego. There are quite a few photos of him with his archetype serial killer’s posting next to all kinds of animals, even a rhino. Bribe money did not go to them but into someone’s pocket.
This lion’s 24 cubs are now vulnerable to another male lion. I’m sure this dentist from MN didn’t even think of that in his lust to have a trophy. Talk about Little Shop of Horrors dental practice!
He’s now saying he ‘didn’t know’ and that he assumed his hunting guides took care of all the necessary permits, and has given out a scripted response full of his regrets, assurances of his high ethics in a sport he loves. Lawyered up.
Who was there at night with a spotlight, and who was there when the collar was removed and attempted to destroy it. The entitlement is staggering with these people.
Taking the “I Tot It Was A Coyote’ Defense Around the World
oops that should read ‘archetype serial killer’s grin’.
It would appear Mr. Palmer is now the hunted, in the court of Public Opinion:
Sarah H. wrote: “I’ll admit, a trip to the dentist has never been my favorite, but I can’t imagine a more horrific experience than waking up to realize a penny of my hard-earned money had gone to assist this man in his heartless pursuit of micropenile compensation.”
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/walterpalmer-from-lion-hunter-to-hunted/34414420
Nancy I read another one that said Palmer’s 50K might have been better spent on seeing a shrink to determine why he gets off on killing large endangered magnificent wildlife.
I think people i general do not approve of or support trophy hunting and find it appalling.
A friend emailed that its all over the news back east, he has closed his practice…. people were leaving stuffed toy animals on the doorstep.
CNN story
http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/29/africa/zimbabwe-cecil-the-lion-killed/index.html
Jimmy Kimmel
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/jimmy-kimmel-chokes-up-air-811799
In his PR spiel for his clients, he says he photographs wildlife, with no mention of what he actually does.
But this case might have a silver lining – it shows with no uncertainty how guarantees of ethical behavior of hunters and guides cannot be relied upon, and how the killing of an animal does not help conserve them but actually puts all of them in jeopardy, such as this lion’s cubs.
And it may help forward the ban on importing endangered animal trophies too. Cecil’s Law is a good name for it.
I was thinking that, too. Zimbabwe does want Palmer for questioning regarding poaching, but I doubt that he will be charged or serve any prison/jail time. He’s rich and American. Free pass. His only consequences will be his life has been temporarily inconvenienced. The onerous will be burdened by the landowner and guide. One thing, Walter Palmer is still a convicted felon in America. Similar lie, but he is still a felon.
There is something not right in the head of these people that “love” to kill. Warped. I wish there was a psychiatrist that would research how their brains are wired differently than the those of us with empathy for other beings.
Dentist-lion killer Palmer may have other problems to plague him in the coming months.
A Slate writer postulates a possible extradition to Zimbabwe. One might also suggest his ethical fitness to practice dentistry, as a one time convicted felon for another matter, combined with any conviction that might plague him from another country, should he decide to re-open a dental clinic following the closing of his current practice. What an idiot for so many reasons.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2015/07/28/walter_palmer_alleged_lion_killer_he_can_be_tried_in_the_u_s_or_extradited.html
It would appear Zimbabwe believes the extradition option is viable.
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/killer-of-cecil-the-lion-should-be-extradited-zimbabwe-says/ar-BBlg6EO
It appears some Americans also believe it should be, with a petition to the White House:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/walter-palmer-white-house-will-respond-to-petition-to-extradite-cecil-the-lion-hunter-10429452.html
I’ve always appreciated this statement. It has broad inclusions, and is an appropriate fit in this situation.
” “If we hunters don’t clean up our own act, someone else will do it for us and we won’t like the results, but when that time comes, and it surely will, these “hunters” will have only themselves to blame.”
I believe that time is here, Immer.
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/cecil-backlash-where-is-walter-palmer/34435448?item=1
http://www.takepart.com/article/2015/07/29/big-game-hunters-and-cecil-lion
I think there is still lots of outrage over other things that are wrong with our society and unfair treatment of its members, but it’s disturbing to see people think that caring about bad treatment of wildlife means we don’t care about people. It’s deliberately divisive. Life matters.
For example, apparently Rip Van Winkle over at the Washington Post just woke up and discovered elephants are being slaughtered for their ivory in Kenya and other countries. Just because he doesn’t appear to be aware of it, doesn’t mean others haven’t read/written/howled chapter and verse about it, and it is ongoing. These articles seem to want to deliberately divide and take the focus on the cold-blooded, illegal killing of this poor animal.
http://www.latimes.com/world/africa/la-fg-lion-killing-20150728-story.html
Cecil’s fate doesn’t stand alone, it’s a trend with all of our wildlife, and Americans (embarrassingly for other Americans) seem to be leading the charge.
http://www.latimes.com/world/africa/la-fg-lion-killing-20150728-story.html
I’m glad to see people the world over passionately speaking out about this cold-blooded killer and others like him. He’s got a history of it too, so it’s not like he can be believed.
I would not like to see this escalate into violence, but to me, it is the Internet equivalent of the public stocks, where bad behavior is made known, and it is historically how things change, when bad behavior becomes totally unacceptable to us.
What we’ve been doing up till now just hasn’t been working, and these killers just run roughshod over laws. Where he’s disregarded law and decency before, he really should be held accountable in some way for his most recent crime.
I think a lot of his clients will dump him on their own.
oops, sorry, this is the WP link about the elephants killed in Kenya:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2015/07/29/as-the-world-mourned-cecil-the-lion-five-of-kenyas-endangered-elephants-were-slain/
Nancy,
I certainly do nit condone the type of vigilantism directed at this individual. Unfortunately for many folks, in one way shape form or another during their lives sh%t where they sleep. I will humbly admit to the aforementioned analogy.
For most, it’s something small, and life after taking the lumps and bumps associated with the act, go on with their lives. I fear for this mans safety.
I believe Yvette brought up the case is Ms. Bland in Texas. Where is the outrage associated with that situation.
My comment was more in the line with the hunting community. One of my best friends up here is an avid deer hunter. He works hard at it and is quite successful in his hunting. During conversation about Dr. Palmer, my friend said that he (Palmer) gave every hunter a black eye whether they know it or not in regard to public opinion.
The world is a fickle place, and becoming more so on a daily basis.
Immer, I can’t help but wonder if the outrage right now over Cecil is not brought on in part by the frustration over incidents like Ms. Bland, Ferguson, the church shootings recently. Too many incidents of “gee, I thought” when actually there was little if any thought or consideration.
With all the negativity going on in the world, its hard to stay on wildlife topics here.
Re: Palmer? I don’t condone the vigilantism either but it is a classic example of that old saying “what goes around, comes around”
Nancy,
We are in agreement.
Immer I would not fear too much for his safety with 50K at his disposal to kill a lion and hoardes of other kills he will probably weather the storm and be right back at it as soon as its over. I don’t condone the threats either but I am happy that he is suffering from a black eye that he deserves and that the trophy hunting industry is getting the scrutiny it deserves. If you are perverted and like to kill wildlife for trophies you might expect some cosmic backlash. He is certainly getting it.
🙂
“Until the lion has his historian, the hunter will always be the hero”
“Until the lions have their own historians, the history of the hunt will always glorify the hunter.” – Chinua Achebe
Chinua Achebe would disagree but to my mind it’s worthwhile to read Mr Joseph Conrad’s novels “Heart of Darkness” etc to get some insight how ‘hunter’s’ mindset is working
http://blog.humanesociety.org/wayne/2015/07/cecil-lion-killed-by-trophy-hunter.html
good blog on the depravity of trophy hunting
Betty McCollum, a Democrat member of Congress who represents Minnesota, called on the US Fish and Wildlife Service and the Department of Justice to investigate whether the killing violated endangered species laws, according to the local Star Tribune.
Tweet from Newt Gingrich: The entire team that killed the lion Cecil should go to jail including the Minneapolis dentist.
Jimmy Kimmel gave them hell too. Thank you all, it’s nice to see people care.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jul/29/cecil-the-lion-calls-for-prosecution-us-dentist-walter-palmer
I think its interesting that when an iconic lion is shot dead for a trophy there is an uproar but every day canned hunting occurs, predator populations plummet as they are killed for trophies or fun under the pretense of managemenet and these incidents are largely ignored. Don’t get me wrong, I am happy to see the adverse press and hope that trophy hunting will become as passe and politically incorrect as date rape, gay bashing, and racial prejudice. Killing wildlife for sport must be ended, and it will take laws and public outrage like this. But somehow, the multitude of faceless nameless animals that are trapped, snared, and shot for sport need to obtain the same level of recognition as the Lamar wolf and Cecil. They are all equally as individual and significant. The potential consequences from the killings all as grim, taudry and sad.
On Twitter last night there were people upset that #CeciltheLion was getting more attention than #SandraBland, and quite a few others that have been killed by cops or died in jails recently. Of course those things are just as important but I have no idea why one thing will take off on the internet and create a furor.
Last night Chris Hayes interviewed someone and had a short segment on Cecil’s killing. Other than he referred to Cecil as an ‘it’ rather using the pronoun, ‘he’, what really struck me was that he said, “I did not know this was even a thing people did.”
What thing is he referring to? Trophy hunting? Poaching? Big game hunting with men who ‘love’ to kill and pose for pictures with their the bloody propped up body of their victim? If by ‘thing’ Chris Hayes meant hunting or poaching then I’m shocked because that means there are likely thousands of other people out there that are clueless as to the plight of wildlife. He is an anchor / journalist and he doesn’t know this is a ‘thing’ people do?
If nothing else, the loss of Cecil (and likely his 23-27 cubs) will enlighten a few more people to wildlife’s plight against trophy hunters. Maybe he will learn what goes down right here in America.
These things have caused a furor, people took to the streets and nearly destroyed Baltimore over them, I’ve seen outrage over Boko Haram, etc being thrown around the same way.
This is just people who want to take the focus off this man’s behavior and try that tired excuse that people who care about animal welfare don’t care about people – which is not true.
This is another one of those things that appears in various forms when animals are harmed and people show outrage about it. I think it was the way this man behaved that is causing the outrage, and he doesn’t treat women too well either from what I’ve read.
Here’s an article about how we should be more concerned about the human rights abuses in Zimbabwe and Cecil’s killing, but one of the comments I think sums up well why people are outraged (first comment, Joy) – trophy hunting is a holdover from white colonialism and privilege, and exploits these nations’ poor.
http://www.religionnews.com/2015/07/29/let-cecil-lions-death-shine-light-zimbabwes-human-rights-abuses-commentary/
I’ve even read one article who had the audacity to suggest that people aren’t concerned about gun violence, when it is hunting and gun lobbies that stand in the way of any kind of addressing of gun violence and gun control!
Yvette I see this over and over people are shocked when they learn that trapping, trophy hunting and killing contests are still legal
the actions are so egregious that most can’t comprehend that they are still legal!
trophy hunters are scum.
http://www.dailyastorian.com/news/20150727/judge-clears-barred-owl-removal-study?utm_source=Daily+Astorian+Updates&utm_campaign=93d3c034b9-TEMPLATE_Daily_Astorian_Newsletter_Update&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_e787c9ed3c-93d3c034b9-109860249
more human tinkering
During the past 20 years harvest levels have been reduced by 80% in federal forests in the Pacific Northwest, with virtually no loss of old growth harvest, yet northern spotted owls continue to decline at a high rate with the main threat from barred owls. Although the finding that northern spotted owls would continue to decline until habitat conditions improve, the high rate of loss to barred owls was unanticipated. Until recently barred owls were fairly uncommon in the NW but they prey on NSO’s and thus have displaced NSO’s from some of the best habitat. The alternative to not have human intervention, will mean NSO populations will continue to decline and that would be in violation of the ESA.
The USFWS has so far killed about 125 barred owls in two years and even though the article stated 3,600 were to be removed within 4 years, clearly this goal will not be even close to being met.
as the plaintiffs argued it was possible that the two species of owls might find a niche to coexist. The killing of the barred owls detracts from the harder decisions to be made about forest management that require habitat preservation. It is now commonplace to kill off species instead of addressing the root problems or curtailing human impacts.
+ Louise
“as the plaintiffs argued it was possible that the two species of owls might find a niche to coexist.”
Both species are hybridizing. I wonder how this will affect spotted owl genetics down the road.
http://www.sierraforestlegacy.org/Resources/Conservation/SierraNevadaWildlife/CaliforniaSpottedOwl/CASPO-Kelly04.pdf
http://www.livescience.com/51681-northern-white-rhino-dies.html
This is awful, I think of the red wolf with about 80 or so and the Mexican wolves with about the same and our derelict/corrupt USFWS shooting trespassing wolves that haven’t even committed the heinous crime of killing a livestock animal and think, what chance do we have with institutional and political ignorance like that. When animal populations that were once thousands, hundreds of thousands or even millions at all time lows its mind boggling that the agencies don’t take every precaution to safeguard them and increase numbers.
Fencing research in Montana that “bears” watching.
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/researchers-study-how-bears-interact-with-electric-fences/34248720
The comment period for APHIS Idaho Wildlife Services EA is closed and the verdict is in: ~99% against using lethal methods to kill wildlife. Of course agencies ultimately don’t decide based on public opinion, but clearly considering the best available science, an increasing use of effective non-lethal deterrence methods implemented by ranchers and the overwhelming opposition against the status quo should make an interesting decision outcome.
I expect either Alternative 3 or 4 will be selected; requiring non-lethal methods to be used before the guns start firing, traps start being set or the poisons begin spilling.
Gary, where did you see the published results? I’m very interested. I’m quite sure that if really looked at and catalogued comments across the board would be against the whole scale killing and hunting of predators that is common. Take the MI vote on whether to hunt wolves or not for example…..Agencies are making decisions about wildlife that run contrary to majority opinion and often against independent scientific reccomendeations. Thanks for posting that can you post a link?
Louise, I didn’t actually do a calculation but reading all of the comments only one or two out of over 200 were in support of WS killing wildlife for the benefit of ranchers, especially when grazing on public lands.
http://www.regulations.gov/#!docketBrowser;rpp=25;po=0;dct=PS;D=APHIS-2014-0105
Yakima irrigators use canals to keep streams flowing in drought
http://www.westcoast.fisheries.noaa.gov/stories/2015/21_07212015_yakima_canal_flows.html
Here is some very important information from Zimbabwe about this situation:
Originally posted by Zimbabwe Wildlife Conservation:
We have been following these threads with great interest. we emphasize we are advocates of “sustainable utilization ” as a conservation tool , some Basic facts that have been verified by several reliable and credible sources :-
The operator / professional hunters in question had a valid TR2 form stamped by the Zimbabwe parks & wildlife authority. This form once stamped allows a hunt to take place.” authority to hunt”
Each and every property or hunting concession to be hunted by the registered operator/client / professional hunter during the course of conducting the hunt must be recorded on this TR2 form
All hunting Quota’s are issued by Zimbabwe parks Authority, and ARE AREA SPECIFIC!!! The property in question where the lion was hunted is “Antonette”, which incidentally was legally owned by Peter Johnston /Rosslyn Safaris, and was taken without compensation during the land grab. This could get
Any off take of animals be it for cropping, management or trophy hunting purposes has to be applied for and approved. The land owner is then issued with a “quota” which is valid from 01/01 -31/12 of each year. Few clients fully understand the different land classifications Zimbabwe has for its hunting industry.
1.government hunting concessions
2.communal areas – campfire or tribal areas generally with human settlement within these areas
3.private land – farms, ranches, conservancies
All these areas have different regulations and rules. There is no one standard set of laws that govern safari hunting across these land classifications. Naturally this is where the foreign client assumes his hunt should or will be legal and be compliant in local laws etc. His link being the professional hunter for everything that happens on the ground during the hunt, and in most cases the “operator” or company he has contracted to hunt through would have done all the paper work for his hunt, TR2 / hunt registration etc.
99% of clients will never have had sight of the areas quota, again here he is generally relying on/be guided accordingly by his professional hunter. So client arrives in camp, he has probably not had sight of this TR2, as these are acquired ahead of time, usually before the clients even arrive in Zimbabwe, all necessary information is usually taken from the safari contract form or is forwarded by client / booking agent to operator / professional hunter. He would have his basic list of main species he would be hunting. Off they go hunting.as soon as you leave camp and have rifles prepared,tracker etc. on your vehicle you are deemed to be hunting, have the intent to hunt, look for, track stalk etc.
Here is where the problem starts… Even if this client/hunter had shot a bushbuck, hyena, or whatever other animal/bird etc. for that matter, that was not on the approved hunting quota for the said property for that current hunting year. They are technically hunting legally in terms of the authority to hunt , the valid TR2 form, but he has just killed an animal without the relevant approved and allocated quota / tag for that specific property. You have just poached that species . The onus is on the professional hunter conducting the safari, and the buck stops with him period!!
1.there is no law gazetted in Zimbabwe that specifically forbids the shooting of collard animals. It’s the unwritten rule amongst “professional hunters” should the collar be visible that these animals are off limits.
2.of the 65 or so lions that have been collard in Matabeleland north ( Hwange, Gwaai, Victoria Falls, etc.) in the past decade or so, 35 have died, with 24 of these being shot by either sport hunters, on problem animal control – cattle killers, man eaters etc. . In the event one is killed, it’s professional to return the collard to the research organization with date,location etc. the animal was killed etc.
3.the professional hunter/land owner did themselves no favors by trying to destroy the lions collar. No lion tag/quota , there was mention of “quota transfer “.. This is absolutely diabolical , but unfortunately is has and still happens. That’s a lengthy topic which we will go in depth about in a separate post.
4. Did the client actually know the operator / land owner had no lion on quota? We very much doubt it.
5. Did the operator / professional hunter probably take a chance, hell yes!! If the lion had been cleanly killed, would we be in the PR storm we find ourselves in… Most probably not.
6.the operator and the land owner appeared in court today in Hwange, and were granted bail.
Unfortunately some operators and professional hunters continue to “manipulate the system”, quota transfers between areas, unsustainable quotas, with the blessing of government offices and / or use of influential political partners, moral and/or scientific conservation ethics are sacrificed for financial gain. Until there is a complete and thorough restructuring in the relevant ministry, government departments, and even our local hunting associations to a lesser degree our wildlife heritage will remain at risk.
I don’t know if I’d call it vigilanteism, because nobody’s done anything but call for justice and order. By today’s standards, we’d never have had an American Revolution. But I love words and their etymology, so the word history is very interesting, just keeping watch where the law is ‘imperfect’:
vigilante
n.
“member of a vigilance committee,” 1856, American English, from Spanish vigilante, literally “watchman,” from Latin vigilantem (see vigilance ). Vigilant man in same sense is attested from 1824 in a Missouri context. Vigilance committees kept informal rough order on the frontier or in other places where official authority was imperfect.
Here’s a good article, I think, about that it isn’t just Cecil alone:
And while the act of shooting a beloved Zimbabwean lion is not exactly the same as industrial farming, the mentality — the cognitive dissonance, the sense of entitlement, the complete disregard for animals as living beings rather than furry commodities — is identical.
Speaking to the Atlantic in 2011, Joel Salatin, the American farmer and advocate, took that idea a step further: “I would suggest that a culture that views life from that kind of disrespectful arrogant standpoint will view its citizens the same way and other cultures the same ways,” he said.
http://news.nationalpost.com/life/food-drink/cecil-the-lions-shooting-death-and-the-premium-we-pay-to-treat-animals-as-commodities
http://siberiantimes.com/other/others/news/n0332-are-you-my-mother/
“The bill would officially define hydro as a “clean” source of energy and end roadblocks that slow development and licensing, including the completion of the Clark Canyon and Gibson dams in Montana — which Sen. Daines says are important for creating a diverse mix of energy in the West. Yet John Seebach, Vice President for River Basin Coordination at American Rivers, says the bill is essentially “a hydropower industry wish list” and limits the authority that federal agencies have to require fish passage. “It’s about the industry not wanting to have to pay to restore fisheries that they wiped out decades ago by building hydropower dams without fish passage,””
But…
“The last section of the package includes the one provision that seemingly no one can find fault with: permanently authorizing the Land and Water Conservation Fund (LWCF).”
https://www.hcn.org/articles/did-the-senate-just-unveil-a-357-page-preview-of-the-nations-new-energy-policy
http://newsdaily.com/2015/07/when-is-a-jackal-not-a-jackal-when-its-really-a-golden-wolf/
Looks like a lot like a coyote Jeff E 🙂
I kind of like the name “Golden Wolf”.
Becoming a high school mascot name near you soon. 8>)
Seems the names for canines are in flux in Africa and Asia. The striking contrast of red-brown and white on the Ethiopian wolf looks snappy.
Whine time at its very best… out here in the west 🙂
“Wyoming Gov. Matt Mead says the BLM is wrong to portray livestock grazing as a threat to sage grouse. Montana Gov. Steve Bullock says the federal plan would prohibit oil and gas leasing”
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/Wyoming-Montana-governors-unsatisfied-with-sage-grouse-plan/34446572
In the latest issue of National Geographic – “Hall of Shame” lots of trophy animals and, an arrogant looking trophy wife to boot:
http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2015/08/taxidermy/clark-photography#/10-dallas-safari-hunters-670.jpg
I don’t know what to say. It just reeks of greed and sickness. Why isn’t one animal enough?
Perhaps when we perfect our techniques to bring back extinct animals, we’ll have a ready supply of DNA. Seems a rather wasteful and roundabout way to go about protecting endangered species tho. But that’s humans for you. We haven’t changed a bit, and sadly our lions, elephants, rhinos and others are going to disappear just as the passenger pigeon did.
I was reading where no sooner did Palmer kill a collared lion than he asked about getting an elephant too. I guess he was on a tight schedule and only had a couple of days. I hope they nab this guy and throw his ass in jail.
Nancy, I have a friend who does tromp l’oeil painting on ceilings and walls. She is quite talented and is hired by people all over the world, or used to be. Once when visiting her in Palm Beach she brought me to the Breyer mansion where she was working on a domed ceiling. On leaving the premises she also opened a door and showed me a room something like the one in this link. There were images from all over the world reminiscent of that once in vogue Ernest Hemingway style trophy hunting era that was devastating to Africa’s game animals. Like me, my friend was an animal lover and had taken the commission not having seen the death room. I’ve never forgotten the revulsion I felt on seeing the tusks, zebra and giraffe hides, and grinning over corpses of dead creatures.
We have had extensive coverage of the interaction between Greenpeace and the Shell ship which was docked in Portland for repairs. Thirteen protesters from Greenpeace suspended themselves more than a day ago by ropes from the St. Johns bridge in an attempt to prevent the Fennica from leaving dry dock to go to the Arctic to support drilling activities. Drilling could not continue until this ship arrived on site. This morning the ship tried to move down the Willamette but was stopped by the dangling protesters that had lowered themselves about 50 feet so they were positioned to interfere with the ships passage. Supporters in kayaks were also present. The Fennica retreated upstream at which time government officials from Alaska and Oregon conversed. A court order from Alaska dictated that the ship must be allowed to continue on its journey. Four protesters were lowered from their positions and the ship again headed for the opening under the bridge. Kayaks again tried to block the advancement resulting in a lot of interplay between them and the authorities. Eventually the Fennica passed under the bridge. Several protesters received citations; however, in general they felt they had a victory by slowing the activity of continued extraction of oil from the North Slope.
I am continually amazed at the efforts of Greenpeace activists all over this planet. I hope the efforts of these brave individuals inspire future generations to also get involved.
I agree absolutely!
The Zimbabweans are baffled over the fuss about the lion:
http://www.nola.com/outdoors/index.ssf/2015/07/zimbabwean_baffled_by_foreign.html
“Panda diplomacy was a meaningful part of the development of China-U.S. relations, Chen argued, starting with the arrival of pandas Ling-Ling and Hsing-Hsing in 1972 following President Richard Nixon’s visit to China after 25 years of separation. “Especially when difficulties are encountered, pandas can tie together two countries’ governments, peoples, and even business sectors,” Chen said. In a recent Washington Post editorial, Chinese Ambassador to the United States Cui Tiankai called Bao Bao China’s “second ambassador.”
http://foreignpolicy.com/2013/12/06/even-chinese-people-are-baffled-by-how-much-americans-love-pandas/
Nancy, this is wonderful. I’d love to see all of our nations get together to protect our wildlife. The first thing is to respect other countries and their laws, I think.
I was surprised that the article you linked made a statement about the anger in the U.S. in the first paragraph. I was seeing quite a lot of anger over Cecil two or more weeks ago coming out of the UK.
I don’t know about the Zimbabwe citizens, but there have been multiple representatives from conservation groups that are angry, not baffled.
Poachers infiltrate park, kill 5 elephants
https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/world/2015/07/30/world-mourned-cecil-lion-five-kenya-endangered-elephants-were-slain/di1syGcr7ayEBOY5sf2tyO/story.html
“While the world mourned Cecil, a devastating poaching incident was quietly carried out in Kenya.”
I had read this article – it really is an opinion. It’s not like people haven’t noticed the regular poaching of elephants and aren’t doing anything to try to stop it. They have and are.
The outcry about Cecil
is really an outcry for all poached, overhunted and objectified wildlife, and I think Cecil is where people have finally had enough. Americans behaving badly is not how we want to be thought of.
I have not visited Africa, and I plan to one day, my sister-in-law visited Tanzania. It will be the thrill of a lifetime to see these magnificent animals.
“The outcry about Cecil is really an outcry for all poached, overhunted and objectified wildlife, and I think Cecil is where people have finally had enough. Americans behaving badly is not how we want to be thought of.”
I just learnt that 50000 (!!) Germans are considered as big game trophy hunters!
So Germany is No.2 behind the USA.
America wants to be exceptional for all the right reasons, not the wrong ones! 🙂
Acting like entitled Americans abroad is not what we like to hear about ourselves. Our ‘hunters’ are used to getting just a slap on the wrist and a low fine.
I hope this is a start to curtail illegal wildlife trafficking and poaching by all nations in the world.
The poaching happening in African countries seems unstoppable. One elephant killed every 15 minutes is the number conservationists have stated. From CITES: ”
It is estimated that in Africa’s MIKE sites, 17,000 elephants were illegally killed in 2011; 15,000 in 1012; and 14,000 in 2013. By extrapolating these data at continental level, over 25,000 elephants may have been poached across Africa in 2011; over 22,000 in 2012; and over 20,000 in 2013.”
….yet they are still being legally hunted.
Zimbabwe to US: Extradite Dentist Over Killing of Cecil the Lion (CNN)
“Zimbabwe has started extradition proceedings and hopes the US will cooperate.”
http://newsdaily.com/2015/07/saving-rhinos-in-a-lab/
http://www.idahostatesman.com/2015/07/30/3917988_rocky-barker-hunters-stupid-act.html?rh=1
Oregon Commission consideration of wolf delisting moved to October, November meetings
The date for the meeting will be announced soon on the Commission webpage. Public testimony will be taken at the meetings but can also be emailed to odfw.comments@state.or.us Please make sure to include “Comments on Wolf Delisting Proposal” in the subject line of emails.
Links to video of the Rogue Pack yearlings also given.
http://www.dfw.state.or.us/Wolves/wolf_program_updates.asp
http://blog.humanesociety.org/wayne/2015/07/shut-down-lion-trophy-imports.html?utm_source=feedblitz&utm_medium=FeedBlitzRss&utm_campaign=humanenation
I find this extremely well written and on point. I would like to see the same appreciation and outrage for wolves and other large carnivores in the US. There is no need to trophy hunt social, intelligent and biologically significant wildlife in Africa, or here. There are some 30,000 lions on the African continent. In the lower US there are less than an estimated 5000 wolves, less than a hundred red and mexican wolves and a couple hundred Alexander Archipelago wolves. The same outage is deserved for killing these animals.
The same outage is deserved for killing these animals.
It is. I’m hoping that this incident will ‘shine a spotlight’ on abuse of wildlife in our country too. I do hope in the next administration that Raul Grijalva will be appointed Secretary of the Interior.
https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/house-bill/2697/text
This Somsai character seems to be overly confident that he and others like him have politicians in their pockets. It doesn’t appear to be so.
Here’s a fascinating post from HP about hunting euphemisms:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/walter-palmer-lion-take-kill-word-choice_55b8e465e4b0a13f9d1aea2c
Agree Ida.
It’s also important to realize that this discussion has been going on for a long time–maybe this shows how resistant human animals are to the idea of speciesism and the benefits it confers on us…maybe it’s also a reflection of how the immediacy of social media has changed activism and the spread of ideas. Here’s a Joan Dunayer essay from 1990 on the same topic:
http://www.ontheissuesmagazine.com/1990winter/winter1990_dunayer.php
I popped in here to try and share some cool news. And it’s timely. Wanted to have some good news after the Cecil ordeal.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/31/movies/illuminating-the-plight-of-endangered-species-at-the-empire-state-building.html?smid=fb-share
Unfortunately, before I got to the NYTs link I found this. Jericho was doing opposite of what conservations expected. They expected him to kill Cecil’s cubs, but he didn’t. He was protecting them and the pride of lionesses. Now he’s been killed. Someone went into Hwange and poached him. When I saw the headlines I was hoping it was a newslo or Onion article. It’s not.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3182428/Cecil-s-brother-Jericho-shot-dead-poachers-Zimbabwean-park.html?ito=social-facebook
I’m hoping this is not real. A mistake.
Hunting of lions, leopards and elephants outside the park has been suspended with immediate effect, the Zimbabwe Parks and Wildlife Management Authority said on its website. Bow hunting has also been suspended unless approved by the authority’s director.
Zimbabwe Suspends Hunting Outside Hwange National Park
I wonder if it is in response to the new suspended hunting rules. Just like our wolves in our National Parks!!!!! I hope it wasn’t another American, and that they arrest whoever is responsible.
He said: ‘Both I and the client were extremely devastated that this thing had a collar on because at no time did we see a collar on this lion prior to shooting it.
This thing? How far removed can one get in that line of work before realizing “this thing” was a living, breathing being, till he and his client, passed lots of money, shook hands, set up camp and then walked out one night to end “this thing’s” life?
https://books.google.com/books?id=7XlTAAAAQBAJ&pg=PT371&lpg=PT371&dq=lust+for+life+mentality+hunters&source=bl&ots=Y-I8GjocST&sig=r2ue1LpjTjBTpnK0saPCiRh-EzM&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CEQQ6AEwBmoVChMIxovig-iIxwIVwpWICh2JMw5o#v=onepage&q=lust%20for%20life%20mentality%20hunters&f=false
With regard to Cecil’s murder, the primary law the USFWS-LE will work with is 16 USC 3372 (a)2(A) and the conspiracy statute in 18 USC. Wonder how some of the ideas spawned here in this blog would apply these statutes and regulations? With the proper interviews and evidence that could be collected in Zimbabwe I think it would be pretty straight forward for laying charges. Some questions I have are; is it unlawful in Zimbabwe to use bait for hunting and what contractual orders did Palmer have with the guide to transport the “trophy”? I wonder if the McKittrick policy will enter the scene with regard to Palmer; “I didn’t know anything was unlawful”. I’ve been waiting for the other shoe to drop on the McKittrick deal with regard to, “I didn’t know it was an endangered species”, and “I didn’t know it was unlawful to ____________”, (you fill in the blank). Let no person be surprised if Congress gets involved as the high handed, self-named wildlife conservationists and self-ego champion trophy hunters already have their check books out and having casual conversations with their “in-my-pocket” politician. Whether or not to extradite will be politics only since USFWS and Justice does not have the huevos in wildlife cases to do the Edward Abbey challenge, “Thus far and no Further.”
The underlying foreign law must be clear and concise and clearly put Palmer in violation of that law. After that it’s just politics! So I’m sure he will be back grinding teeth in no time. Maybe his attorneys can work out a donation deal for a museum in Zimbabwe and Palmer can have a $50,000 tax deduction next year! It has happened before with rich Safari International trophy hunters.
“Let no person be surprised if Congress gets involved as the high handed, self-named wildlife conservationists and self-ego champion trophy hunters already have their check books out and having casual conversations with their “in-my-pocket” politician”
+ 1 Larry K.
On the last couple of chapters of Bob Schieffer’s book – This Just In and this paragraph jumped out:
“As long as so many people have a financial interest in keeping partisan lines so sharply drawn, the partisan divide will grow even wider”
Just one of many insightful thoughts/comments from a man that spent a lifetime trolling “the Bay of Politicians” as a news reporter.
A good read…….
You nailed it, Larry. +++++
The good news of the day is the Oxford lion researchers said Jericho’s collar is showing him alive and moving around. Multiple news sources were reporting him as shot and killed by a poacher. They found was a different lion that had been poached. Still, a lion was poached and there just aren’t very many lions left in the world.
The international attention received over the killing of Cecil has surprised me. Congressmen have already gotten involved. A bill has been introduced, Conserving Ecosystems by Ceasing the Importation of Large (CECIL) Animal Trophies Act, would make it illegal for trophy hunters to bring back parts of any species proposed or listed as threatened or endangered under the Endangered Species Act of 1973.”
NJ is doing the same on a state level.
Even if these bills don’t get far, kudos! At least more people are now a wee bit more aware of the plight of wildlife and the gist of trophy hunting.
You know, I’ve never really read much from Edward Abby. I’ve known about him but that is about as far as I’ve taken it. “Thus far and no Further” I love that. Concise and to the point.
“You know, I’ve never really read much from Edward Abby. I’ve known about him but that is about as far as I’ve taken it”
Yvette, my suggestion would be to get to know him in the “bibliophile” sense 🙂
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LvfSoDdWLc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Udhh5yUog_I
this kind of grassroots concern, cycles over and over here on the Wildlife News.
Like “Wyoming Regulates to Increase Pollution in its Streams” a very important topic/thread recently posted here on the WN, and pretty much ignored because elsewhere( the human species) isn’t aware its already being systematically trashed by big special interests, at an alarming rate, when it comes to Planet Earth.
You are right again Nancy. It takes something like the notoriety of killing Cecil just for his head to wake people of to the abhorrent behavior of trophy hunting but everyday crap goes on that is just as abhorrent, maybe in a little different arena like the crap in Wyoming creeks. We as a society are a miserable failure with regard to the responsible use of our advanced brains.
I haven’t yet commented on the WY’s decision to basically ignore the bacteria levels in streams, but I did go the water quality standards academy on the EPA website to review WQS rules and regs on standards, NPDES, designated use of a water body and anti-degradation regs. It’s been a long time since I’ve really looked at CWA regulations. It was information on anti-degradation that I was really interested in, and the problem seems to be most of the numeric standards that states set apply to point source pollution rather than non-point source.
Non-point source, or aka, section 319 is non-regulatory. So, I’m not sure what can be done if WY chooses to let the ranching industry ruin all of their streams. IF it was a CAFO it would be different and would count as a point source, thus, falling under the regulatory sections like NPDES. I suppose, that is why it would be good to know the history of Edward Abby.
Frankly, I think this is a “Thus far and no further” moment for not only Wyoming but everyone downstream, because they will receive it, and that might be the way to deal with WY’s failure to protect their surface water.
I just didn’t comment on the topic thread but meant to return to it.
WM could probably contribute on the legalities of the CWA.
Carl Hiassen also relys on themes that create a protagonist ecosterrorist as the hero in many of his stories, a different genre and style but Hiassen quotes Abbey as his inspiration. Abbey mourning the loss of western land and its development and damming, Hiassen a lifelong witness to the devastation that wrecked Florida and turned a tropical paradise in a cement superhighway dotted with strip malls and homes that drain the biggest wetland in the US.
From Denis Anderson’s column in todays Star Tribune. HIS WORDS, not mine.
1. Night hunting is legal in Zimbabwe, and the way most lions are hunted.
2. Reports allege the lion was baited, which is legal in Zimbabwe.
It will be interesting if they release the collar data which should show just how often the lion was off the preserve and huntable. This lion was aging and may have been feeling pressure from other lions pushing him and his pride from prime spots on the preserve.
I would think dragging a carcass through the preserve to still be illegal?
http://www.startribune.com/wisconsin-dentist-mistaken-for-killer-of-cecil-the-lion/320389731/
legal if baited to be drawn outside of the park?
“Not far from Denver’s abandoned Stapleton International Airport sits what’s probably the saddest, most macabre collection of property owned by the U.S. government.
Officially, it’s called the National Wildlife Property Repository.
In reality, it holds thousands of confiscated animal items that Americans and others have tried to illegally import into the United States.”
Continued, with shocking video, here (really? a pencil holder???):
http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/31/us/illegal-animal-trade/
Good commentary from one of lion researchers that studied Cecil and he has an opinion on Walt Palmer’s actions.
http://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/man-who-studied-cecil-the-lion-for-9-years-talks-impact/
Two bear attacks in three months? Makes you wonder if WS got the “right” bear in April.
Yesterday’s attack
http://www.kirotv.com/news/news/man-attacked-bear-at-jblm/nnBjX/
April attack (Wildlife Services called in and killed a bear)
http://q13fox.com/2015/04/16/joint-base-lewis-mcchord-employee-injured-in-bear-attack-on-base/
“Officials say the man was a civilian moving around in a restricted training area, and that he was not supposed to be there.
It is unclear why he was there, according to officials”
“gates into Engineer Bluff will remain closed for the next week”
These reports/news links are rather confusing Moose. Gates to what…..are being closed off?
Is this like a “gated” community and wildlife is somehow slipping in to terrorize the good folks stationed there? 🙂
JBLM covers a very large area with many tracts of heavily forested land. The gated part is for live ammunition training (among other things) – unauthorized personnel appearing in such areas is cause for safety and security concerns.
The base is home to a good number of bears….I’m guessing WS might have shot the next bear to appear in the general area of the first attack…and assumed it to be guilty bear. Or, could be the bears are just sick of all the damn explosions and are revolting.
State Game and Fish Dept. rejects federal request to release wolf pups
http://www.abqjournal.com/622288/news/fed-request-to-release-wolf-pups-rejected.html
LETTER: Will grizzlies go the way of Cecil?
http://www.dailyinterlake.com/members/letter-will-grizzlies-go-the-way-of-cecil/article_aef22596-38b0-11e5-a942-733f2351e0a7.html
http://www.sacbee.com/news/state/california/fires/article29790817.html
Just read a short but good article from Dr. Pieter Kat, of Lionaid.org. Dr. Kat has researched lions for decades and he addresses a couple of questions I’ve had for a long time regarding the mind of a trophy hunter. I’ve searched academic databases for sociological and/or psychological research but have yet to find precisely what I’m looking for.
http://www.lionaid.org/news/2015/08/are-trophy-hunters-pyschopaths.htm
Especially since this person has many, many animal trophies. One or even a few doesn’t seem to be enough, and why that is troubles me. The trophy rooms are frightening, because don’t these people care about extinction?
After he supposedly made the ‘mistake’ of killing a collared animal, he then proceeds to skin and behead it, and then inquire about getting an elephant too, with ivory. Doesn’t sound like he was all that broken up about it. That part is really concerning because elephants are under huge pressure from poaching and hunting. It appears to me that he bribed the guides, and of course there’s all the other charge against him in WI, and the harassment charge. If the internet can be believed, boasting to waitresses as if he were Ernest Hemmingway does not impress.
The young Kendall Jones reminds me of a child or early teenager who still likes to hug stuffed animals, only in her case she doesn’t seem to get that they are living things first.
And I can’t forget the collar. Thank goodness that is what has trapped him. And I mistakenly typed ‘it’ when I should have typed ‘he’ regarding Cecil.
Loose interpretations of wildlife laws do not apply in other countries, thank goodness, and I really resent that this man could take that horrible entitled attitude in other countries.
Hunter gets his.
https://video.xx.fbcdn.net/hvideo-xtf1/v/t42.1790-2/10583656_10152367916663889_2000717303_n.mp4?efg=eyJybHIiOjg1MSwicmxhIjo1MTJ9&rl=851&vabr=473&oh=41daa148e14c43dee78da43a03b36853&oe=55BFE43A
Dr. Rosie Clooney is Chair of the Sustainable Use and Livelihoods Specialist Group at the International Union for Conservation of Nature (IUCN).
Zimbabwe: R.I.P Cecil the Lion. What Will Be His Legacy? and Who Decides?
OPINION
By Dr. Rosie Clooney
London — Cecil the lion, a magnificent senior male, much loved and part of a long-term research project, was lured out of a safe haven in Zimbabwe’s Hwange National Park last week and apparently illegally shot, to endure a protracted death.
As the global outrage pours out, consider for a moment that trophy hunting has now been banned across Africa. Trophy hunting is the limited “high value” end of hunting, where people (often the wealthy and mainly Westerners) pay top dollar to kill an animal. In southern Africa it takes place across an area close on twice the sum total of National Parks in the region.
Hwange Park staff numbers have been radically cut, and there is little money for cars or equipment for protection. Bushmeat poaching is on the rise and the rangers are ill equipped to cope.
It arouses disgust and revulsion – animals are killed for sport – in some cases (such as lions) the meat not even eaten. Even the millions of weekend recreational hunters filling their freezers are uncertain about trophy hunting.
It seems to have little place in the modern world, where humanity is moving toward an ethical position that increasingly grants animals more of the moral rights that humanity grants (in principle at least) to each other.
So let us move now through the thought bubble where the EU and North America ban import of trophies, Namibia, South Africa, Zimbabwe and others ban trophy hunting, the airlines and shipping lines refuse to carry trophies, and the industry dies a slow (or fast) death, ridding the world of this toxic stain on our collective conscience
We turn to survey southern Africa, proud of what we have achieved by our signing of online petitions, our lobbying of politicians, our Facebook shares and comments.
Did we save lions? Have we safeguarded wildlife areas? Have we dealt the death blow to trafficking of wildlife? Have we liberated local communities from imperialistic foreign hunters?
Let’s go back to Hwange National Park, the scene of Cecil’s demise. The Zimbabwe Parks and Wildlife Management Authority, responsible for managing this and other National Parks, is now in trouble.
It derived most of its income for protection, conservation and management of wildlife across the country from trophy hunting, with minimal revenue from central government (not well known for its good governance and transparent resource allocation).
Hwange Park staff numbers have been radically cut, and there is little money for cars or equipment for protection. Bushmeat poaching is on the rise and the rangers are ill equipped to cope. The commonly used wire snares are indiscriminate, and capture many lions and other predators who die agonizing and pointless deaths.
In Namibia, more than half of the communal conservancies (covering 20 percent of the country) have collapsed, because the revenue from non-hunting sources (such as tourism) is not enough to keep them viable and they have not been able to find alternative sources of income.
Namibia’s communal conservancies are an innovation of the 1990s, and have been responsible for dramatic increases in a wide range of wildlife species outside of national parks including elephant, lion, and black rhino. Income from trophy hunting and tourism has encouraged communities to turn their land over to conservation.
Communities retain 100 percent of benefits from sustainable use of wildlife, including hunting – almost 18 million Namibian dollars in 2013. This money was spent by communities on schools, healthcare, roads, training, and the employment of 530 game guards to protect their wildlife.
Almost two million high protein meals a year were a by-product of the hunting. Now this is all gone. A few conservancies managed to find wealthy philanthropic donors to prevent them going under – but they cross their fingers that the generosity will continue to flow for decades to come.
Game guards are unemployed, unable to feed their families, looking for any opportunity to obtain some income. Communities are angry – they were never asked by the world what they thought about this. Few journalists or social media activists ever reflected their side of the story. Conservation authorities and communities are again becoming enemies.
Where the conservancies have collapsed, the wildlife is largely wiped out. The bad old days pre-reform have returned, and wildlife is worth more dead than alive.
Hungry bellies are fed with poached bushmeat and the armed poaching gangs have moved in – communities are no longer interested in feeding information to police to help protect wildlife, game guard programmes have collapsed for lack of funds and have spare targeted to supply the criminal syndicates, and rhino horns, lion bone, and ivory are being shipped out illicitly to East Asia.
In South Africa, trophy hunting has stopped, including the small proportion that was “canned”. On the private game ranches that covered some 20 million hectares of the country, though, revenues from wildlife have effectively collapsed.
Those properties with scenic landscapes that are close to major tourist routes or attractions and have good tourism infrastructure are surviving on revenues from phototourism, but gone are the days of expanding their wildlife asset base by buying land and restocking this with additional wildlife. Most of the other landowners have returned to cattle, goats and crop farming in order to educate their children, run a car, pay their mortgages.
Wildlife on these lands has largely gone along with its habitat – back to the degraded agriculture landscapes that prevailed before the 1970s when wildlife use by landholders (including hunting) became legal here.
Lions that were on these farmlands are long gone, and the few that remain in national parks are shot as problem animals as soon as they leave the park. The great conservation success story of South Africa is rapidly unraveling.
Speculative? Yes, but a reasonable prediction, because this has happened before. Bans on trophy hunting in Tanzania 1973-1978, Kenya in 1977 and in Zambia from 2000-2003 accelerated a rapid loss of wildlife due to the removal of incentives for conservation. Early anecdotal reports suggest similar patterns are already happening in Botswana, which banned all hunting last year.
Let us mourn Cecil, but be careful what you wish for.
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so they want to trophy hunt and trophy hunting is the only option
how about a tax for every visitor that comes into the country, that tax specifically to go toward wildlife conservation. When i go into Great Britian I pay a huge airline tax to enter into those countries even if there is s stopover.
People are going to visit Africa because it is wild, and exotic and amazing. If all of the countries imposed a tax on entry for wildlife conservation, how many would object, how many would not go. I wold wager the countries could collect a whole lot of money and move away from the vile trophy hunting model. Its a bad model that creates a vicious cycle.
Louise there are national parks where those that want to see animals go and they pay an entrance fee, fair enough. There are hunting concessions where a hunter goes to hunt and he pays concession fees and trophy fees, fair enough.
But how much does a wildlife viewer pay for entrance fees vs. a hunter pays in trophy fees. Here is what I propose let the hunter pay his trophy fees and lets charge a wildlife viewer smaller trophy fees for each picture taken and for animals seen. It seems fair.
Not really
the hunter kills and deprives the public the opportunity to ever see the animal, not to mention loss of the animal within its habitat and its contributions to the biodiversity of the region.
I say let all people pay a fee to enter the country and recognize the value of wildlife to the country. Trophy hunting and killing for sport is unsustainable with so many humans on this planet and it encourages a lust for killing that has nothing to do with a need to eat.
I think it devalues wildlife and life
Trophy hunting need not be unsustainable. The owners of the game merely need to have long term interests in mind. I believe that’s true in North America for several native tribes, and large land owners. Why kill bull elk for meat if they can bring 20K dollars is the simple logic. I’ve seen it work in Austria and Romania too – nobody overshoots their place, cause the financial demise would be felt the very next year. I don’t think there are less of the game animals, quite the contrary. This is for animals at densities about at carrying capacity, and non-corrupt venues though – there’s where it might get tricky. I realize there’s a context to what you are saying, but I think you overgeneralize here.
Good read below Elk and by the way, your thoughts re: the future here in the west regarding Brucellosis…. infected elk(not bison) ranching, etc.
Differs little whether its here or there, when it comes to an economy depend on shooting wildlife/ raising livestock.
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/trophy-hunting-explained/
There has been debate on the true economic benefit to conservation from trophy hunting. Lots of data out there on both sides of the debate.
As far as the speculation above maybe she should ask an elephant how that has worked out for them.
Elk: So, — the only way we can provide for our wildlife on this planet is to cater to this sick fetish of head hunting the best of the gene pool? Extortion seems to me to be an applicable label.
We can’t ‘Westernize’ the concept of hunting into an assembly-line machine to kill animals for trophies.
I’m no supporter of hunting, but what’s getting lost in the word shuffle here is that this man allegedly has poached, not hunted, his trophies. The facts still need to be brought out on what actually happened, but he has a history of being dishonest about his activities. It appears he thinks laws don’t apply to him. This is not hunting, and this article as well as many others bring the two together, as well as the beef industry, the sporting industry, and ivory-handled pistol industry. Living creatures are not industries.
Zimbabwe has called a halt because their policies are being abused, and that needs to change.
Another thing is if poaching is a big problem in African nations (and it is), Americans should not be the ones additionally contributing to it!!!!!
To me, it all comes down to:
1. Poaching is not hunting, and they should not be in the same articles together as if they were the same. While many people have moral and ethical concerns about hunting, poaching is a concern morally, ethically and breaking the law, and nobody supports that.
2. Americans should not be violating rules and policies of other nations because they have the money or are used to being privileged or they want something (ugly American). If they want to hunt, then they play by the rules. Show a little self-restraint.
3. What difference does being a ‘senior’ animal make? We don’t feel the same way about ourselves, when it comes time for the males of our species to age gracefully. Our species make tremendous fools of themselves trying to hold on to their youth. Entire industries are devoted to it. It seems rather strange to justify removing older but still productive members of animal herds and packs just because we get to rationalize killing them.
That’s all these articles questioning the outrage about Cecil come down to, to me. The rest is just deliberate obfuscation.
The question is did he knowingly poach? If they want to hunt play by the rules: where are the rules or do the rules change with each government official. A safari in Zimbabwe has a government game scout who is employed by the government of Zimbabwe who job is to make sure the rules are followed. Where was the game scout?
Ida, I would advise you to open your eyes and go traveling. I have been from Johannesburg to Namibia overland. Went hunting in Namibia then overland to Cape Town. Overland from Cape Town to the Malawi/Tanzania border gone three months. This was one of many trips that I have made in my life; I have spent nearly two years on the road traveling the six continents.
It is easy to do, get enough money, limit your pack to 35 pounds get on an airplane and go to Africa. Travel off the beaten path, stay at hostels and learn about unknown adventures, meet people, book those adventures and enjoy. Do not book a 10 day photo safari to Tanzania from the USA with like minded lemmings. You will come back with a large smile and a different outlook.
See you in three months. 🙂
Oh hell, Elk. The man is not stupid and he has at least 43 kills and that many heads and bodies in house. Innocent? Let him prove in a court of law. If that country’s courts are kind too bad. He chose to go and he knew what he was doing. He also is a convicted felon right here in the USA. You know the story; he lied multiple times. The man is twit and he is a lying twit. Funny how that cocktail waitress wasn’t at all impressed by the doctor’s pictures of himself with a dead Cecil. “he regrets it”. Nah, he regrets that his privileged life and status has been temporarily inconvenienced.
Zimbabwe is a kleptocratic, everyone from “Bob” to the poor unemployed villager is on the take. When I was in Zimbabwe I doubled my money on the black market and paid $20 to become a honorable Zimbabwean citizen which allow me to purchase airline tickets, hotel accommodations and tour packages at a faction of the price. Everyone from the hostel was in line replicating what I was doing or was I replicating what there were doing? I was wide spread.
Did the doctor know what was happening? I think he did, but did he really know, time will tell. A hunter depends upon the PH to know the regulations, where they are at, know the quota and follow the laws. Hunting outside of the North America there are no regulation booklets available at the license venders and the laws if available are not typically in English. Quota swapping is wide spread and wildlife officials are the ones that allow it, stamping the request forum from the PH for a $100 bill that the guided hunter would have no knowledge of.
One of my best friends in Bozeman was a parks ranger in Hangwe from 1977 to several months after independence in 1980. He said that the incidence like Cecil would never have happen when they patrolled the park. He also said lets wait and find out what really happened.
One thing is certain is that “Bob” does not like the white run safari industry. This incident could be or is the beginning to eradicate the white safari operators and replace it with indigenous owners.
On a side note I talked with a another friend who operates a long time hunting booking agency. This morning he had a client cancel a Zimbabwe hunt and lose thousands of dollars not wanting to take a chance.
“Zimbabwe has called a halt because their policies are being abused, and that needs to change.” Zimbabwe has not called a halt because their polices are being abused. High government officials want to control the hunting industry.
perhaps rich white americans rely on the guides for the rules but you can bet they understand that dragging a carcass and baiting the lion outside of the park bore some illegal implications. The cry of no mens rea doesn’t ring true. The whole killing is ghastly, people that like to kill these animals seem like they are lacking some kind of connection to the world. They frighten me and the thought that there are so many with permits allowed to harass and kill on whim for sport is disturbing beyond words.
” but you can bet they understand that dragging a carcass and baiting the lion outside of the park bore some illegal implications.”
Dragging a carcass and baiting a lion is not illegal. It is illegal to enter a national park and drag a carcass through the part of the park and across the border. Baiting a lion is not illegal in Zimbabwe nor is night hunting. If the bait was dragged through the park it was illegal but we do not know for sure what happen.
Baiting lions is not easy nor successful. First on has to get a lion of bait and typically they put out 4 to 6 baits and spend days checking baits each days. When they find a where a lion has been feeding then a blind is built which take great skill for proper placement. Then the hunter and PH sit and wait while the lion circle the bait and decides whether to come in and feed. If he senses you he is gone.
In Tanzania on a 21 day full license which includes lion a hunter has a 40% chance of killing a lion in 21 days of hunting. Therefore the average lion killed takes nearly 50 hunting days at $3000 a day or $150,000 per lion.
What I do not like about baiting is the killing of a bail animal in Africa where the population is hungry and needs the meat from the bait animal.
It may not be illegal but it sure is not ‘hunting’.
“In Tanzania on a 21 day full license which includes lion a hunter has a 40% chance of killing a lion in 21 days of hunting. Therefore the average lion killed takes nearly 50 hunting days at $3000 a day or $150,000 per lion.”
Ok Elk so do you think the odds of getting a baited lion will go up as the population dwindles. Will “hunters” claim more skill is needed as the lions disappear. Obviously the cumulative impact of trophy hunting and habitat loss are taking a toll the population has dwindled from 100,000 to 30+-
is it skill or perseverance? Hunters always claim great skill, I wish they could lay claim to great restraint.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/southafrica/11779906/American-huntress-sparks-fury-by-posting-selfie-with-dead-giraffe-in-South-Africa.html
These kind of people have no restraint, they just like to kill to kill. They always quote that its perfectly legal. I think its time to change that. I can’t imagine traveling somewhere exotic with the intent to kill a variety of the creatures that make the place special to start with. Trophy killing is some kind of perverted sickness.
“These kind of people have no restraint, they just like to kill to kill.”
The more and more I see this crap, the more and more I agree.
Was at a friends sons birthday party over the weekend. The boy observed a snow shoe hare and ran for his bow. Pops said, if you shoot it, YOU skin it out and youre eating it for breakfast. The boy put the bow away. Valuable lesson.
yes very valuable lesson too bad not more fathers like that.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/05/opinion/in-zimbabwe-we-dont-cry-for-lions.html?_r=1
“the village boy inside me instinctively cheered: One lion fewer to menace families like mine”
Has a familiar ring to it Jeff E. (wolves, livestock, children at bus stops?)
Kinda lurid, but some insight into the character of and details on Palmer’s “Little Shop of Horrors”. What a disgusting creature. I knew he’d be found to have a wolf. I think there’s much more than meets the eye, and I’m interested to see what else USF&W digs up on him:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3182475/The-lion-hunter-s-house-horror-Dentist-wanted-Cecil-special-shrine-contains-50-animal-heads.html
Little Shop of Horrors? Just do a quick Google picture search for the keyword “trophy room” and you are right in the middle of very big Shops of Horrors!
Yes.
Here’s some more good news. Poor Cecil I think is going to be quite a wakeup call for the world:
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/aug/04/eight-suitcases-full-of-ivory-seized-at-zurich-airport
American, United and Delta will no longer ship lion, leopard, elephant, rhino or buffalo killed by trophy hunters.
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/aug/03/delta-bans-hunting-trophies-cecil-the-lion
http://www.ktvb.com/story/news/local/2015/08/03/judge–idahos-anti-dairy-spying-law-is-unconstitutional/31078421/
something that really matters
While looking up news about this ruling I came across an article about the White Clouds in Idaho Representative Mike Simpson’s HR 1138 passed in the house and how goes to the senate. It designates 275,000 acres as wilderness.
Both stories here:
http://www.boiseweekly.com/boise/boulder-white-clouds-bill-passes-us-house-now-its-up-to-us-senate/Content?oid=3546571
Yes, among other things. Any and all good news is welcome.
Jeff E. and all,
This is great news, but hardly unexpected. I think the only question was when.
I hope this is a big first step in rolling back the nasty anti-public effort by the livestock and dairy industry to use the government to suppress their critics.
In Idaho the livestock industry and government are one and the same. Everything else is just minutia in their eyes
The White Clouds bill has now passed in the Senate.
That is news that matters! Thanks.
Will that have an affect on the similar Wyoming law?
probably not.
Wyoming is in a different federal district
Jeff E. is right. This only applies to the Idaho federal district.
The state of Idaho would be stupid to appeal Judge Winmill’s ruling. There was more wrong with the law than suppression of free speech.
Idaho government, however, is not controlled by reasonable people.
Far be-it from Clement on co. to waste taxpayer money fighting lost causes.
This is out of Zimbabwe a few minutes ago some may cheer and some may shed a tear.
Looks like we may have more info after a meeting
Government, in addition to investigations has put in place the following measures with immediate effect;
Hunting of lions, leopards and elephants in areas outside of Hwange National Park has been suspended .Government is also directing all those currently in the field to stop their hunting activities and withdraw.
Government is very much aware of the financial implications on the Zimbabwe Parks and Wildlife Management Authority, the Safari Industry, CAMPFIRE Communities and Wildlife Producers affected by this suspension and therefore appeals for funding from the donor community and well-wishers to assist Zimbabwe Parks and Management Authority to thoroughly investigate operations of this important hunting industry. Financial resources generated will ensure that Zimbabwe Parks and Wildlife Management Authority has sufficient capacity to monitor the activities of this important hunting industry as required by law. Zimbabwe Parks and Wildlife Management Authority has set up a specific wildlife conservation and monitoring fund for this purpose and well-wishers can deposit the funds into
Barclays Bank, Mgundumu Safaris Branch Code 2157 Account Number 6614241.
–
This is a good thing –
Zimbabwe restricted hunting of lions, elephants, leopards a couple of days ago. There was either 200 or 300K donated to the Oxford researchers since Cecil was killed.
Idaho Ag-Gag bill ruled unconstitutional.
Here is a link to the decision. I certainly enjoyed reading it.
http://media.idahostatesman.com/smedia/2015/08/03/16/32/uXqJn.So.36.pdf
Thanks for posting it Ralph.
The remedy for misleading speech, or speech we do not like, is more speech, not enforced silence”
The only thing that would have been better is to have compelled Clem and Wasden to read the decision aloud in open court in unison. (Tweedle-dee and Tweedle-dum)
now maybe Congress will attach a rider to an omnibus bill making it illegal for whistleblowers to create trouble for Monsanto, Dow or Bayer and place a no judicial review clause in there. You know those frivilous litigation cuts and how tiresome they get when the judgments actually protect natural resources, civil rights or the environmental protections that keep us healthy.
Okay, Palmer took the life of a beloved lion (and hoped to “take” an elephant on the same trip) Maybe he isn’t really in hiding, just off adding another head to his vast collection:
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/hitchhiking-robot-gets-beheaded-in-us/34505454
Good news!
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/money/delta-refusing-to-carry-some-big-game-trophies/34514362
“Among his findings in a 46 page document, Judge Haynes said commissioners failed to take a “hard look” at relevant information over public health and safety, specifically traffic, wildlife and wildlife habitat.
The farmland is adjacent to the Lee Metcalf National Wildlife Refuge”
http://www.nbcmontana.com/news/judge-sides-with-conservation-group-in-legacy-ranch-subdivision-suit/34518066
Wow!
A new documentary will be out soon. “Blood Lions” and on the breeding of lions for canned hunts in SA.
What a great idea!!
http://www.bearaware.com/
Just in from Zimbabwe:
This mornings meeting was well attended, members from both hunting and photographic operators, press, national parks senior staff and some independent guys from scientific sectors and a few NGO’s.
ZCTF “Johnny Rodrigues ” was nowhere to be found.. Shows you how much he cares about the industry, just goes to show how unpopular he is in local conservation circles.
Not a huge amount achieved, but moving in the right direction. A few irate operators who operate on the boundary of the park, as all hunts suspended, including some guys in the field hunting already.
ALL hunting areas in and around the park has been suspended until further notice. It was said and parks agreed, a few unruly elements have caused and are responsible for this crisis, causing everyone operating legally to be tarred with the same brush.it was unanimously agreed that the offending operators / professional hunters involved be prosecuted and charged where they have transgressed any law .
In our opinion these illegal lion off takes occurred in the gwaai conservancy areas, if anything this area should have been suspended to conduct investigations etc.not a blanket suspension .
Mixed messages as usual from national parks, they claiming government has suspended the hunting in these areas. With national parks being the regulatory body, it would be them who would be tasked to remedy this situation. Director General could easily have made this call, and advised his minister, giving the facts and reason etc, but they national parks said it was not their call, and they had been tasked to map the way forward, hence this meeting was called.
Parks were taken to task on the issue of client confidentiality. Members agreed once a offender has been convicted in a court of law, by all means disclose this personal information.but until such time that occurs details should remain confidential and privy to relevant authorities.
Quota transfer – national parks re-iterated this is “illegal “.. And has been stopped with immediate effect. A positive move long overdue. Independent Conservation and industry experts reiterated the need to regulate and police existing regulations effectively, rather than bringing more regulations in as a result of the crisis.
A commitee has been set up with representation from various stake holders within the industry, to formulate and map the way forward, in consultation with national parks. All in all parks have agreed to more of an open door policy, so let’s see moving forward from here. They cannot afford to lose the much needed business from foreign hunters.
There was no mention of extradition of either client in these hunts. We think that rhetoric is most probably political if anything, but still damaging to our industry, as future clients may be hesitant to come to Zimbabwe . These concerns were stressed in strong terms to the national parks Director General aswell.
This fits to the T, the comment I made a few days ago.
Not a huge amount achieved, but moving in the right direction. A few irate operators who operate on the boundary of the park, as all hunts suspended, including some guys in the field hunting already.
ALL hunting areas in and around the park has been suspended until further notice. It was said and parks agreed, a few unruly elements have caused and are responsible for this crisis, causing everyone operating legally to be tarred with the same brush.it was unanimously agreed that the offending operators / professional hunters involved be prosecuted and charged where they have transgressed any law .”
” “If we hunters don’t clean up our own act, someone else will do it for us and we won’t like the results, but when that time comes, and it surely will, these “hunters” will have only themselves to blame.”
+ one, Immer
With bear hound training season coinciding with wolf rendezvous time of the year, the carnage continues.
http://www.superiortelegram.com/news/wisconsin/3810092-wolves-kill-hunting-dogs-summit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHQog4e2fsM
This is brilliant
very nicely shot
excellent message
beautiful girl/woman
hoping a lot of hunters see this
the girl might just change their idea of sexy
Kendall Jones vs her
not even a contest